To all my fellow Canadians...

Hi everyone. Yes, this is another political thread. No one yell at me, I'm just trying to get people's opinions on things. This time I'm asking this; Who were the best Prime Ministers Canada never had? They had to be party leaders, at some point. Here's my list:


1.Sir John Alexander Macdonald (Conservative)
2.***Edward Blake (Liberal)
3.Alexander Mackenzie (Liberal)
4.Sir John Abbot (Conservative)
5.Sir John Thompson (Conservative)
6.Sir Mackenzie Bowell (Conservative)
7.Sir Charles Tupper (Conservative)
8.Sir Wilfrid Laurier (Liberal)
9.Sir Robert Borden (Conservative)
10.Arthur Meighen (Conservative)
11.William Lyon Mackenzie King (Liberal)
12.Richard Bedford Bennett (Conservative)
13.Louis St. Laurent (Liberal)
14.John Diefenbaker (Conservative)
15.***Tommy Douglas (New Democrat)
16.Lester Bowels Pearson (Liberal)
17.***Réal Caouette (Social Credit)
18.Pierre Elliott Trudeau (Liberal)
19.***Robert Stanfield (Conservative)
20.***David Lewis (New Democrat)
21.Joe Clark (Conservative)
22.John Turner (Liberal)
23.***Ed Broadbent (New Democrat)
24.Brian Mulroney (Conservative)
25.Kim Campbell (Conservative)
26.Jean Chrétien (Liberal)
27.***Jean Charest (Conservative)
28.***Lucien Bouchard (Conservative)
29.***Preston Manning (Reform)
30.Paul Martin (Liberal)
31.Stephen Harper (Conservative)
32.***Jack Layton (New Democrat)
33.***Gilles Duceppe (New Democrat)

As for Duceppe and Bouchard, well, I know they were separatists (or still are), but Lulu was part of the PCs before he crossed the floor, and the Bloc is basically the NDP, just remove the separation and focus on Quebec. Let's just pretend the Bloc never existed.
Sure some of this wouldn't make sense, but hey, it's just a survey.

Didnt you just ask this not so long ago?

See:

http://www.queenzone.com/forums/1289234/best-prime-minister-canada.aspx

No, I asked who was the best. Now I'm asking who we didn't have that could have been great.

It's kind of a silly list to begin with, because over a dozen of them were prime minister at some point.

No contest, the best PM Canada never had was Jack Layton.  Many conservatives will even tell you that.  Only Trudeau matched his charisma and love for his country.  Layton would have loosened the corporate/American stranglehold on our political process, moved us closer to the Nordic model that has thrived in northern Europe, and raised the corporate tax rate to balance the budget.  He would've built the country from the bottom up instead of trickling down.  Everything Layton put his hands on was progressive, practical, and most importantly, had the average Canadian citizen in mind.  He was truly a needle in a haystack of politicians.

A close second is Tommy Douglas.  Although he was never PM, even as a third party he gave the country our greatest gift - universal health care.

And please fix the typo that suggests Gilles Duceppe was a New Democrat.  Thankfully this separatist is now unemployed (although his politics weren't all bad).

Captain Kirk

Sir GH/ Real Wizard/ Bob:

To begin with, I put in all 22 prime ministers, so obviously most of them already had the post.

As for the best, I agree with you when you say that Jack would have been the best PM we never had. I've only met 2 people that said that they wouldn't want him as PM. One a right-wing extremist, and one a left-wing extremist. Not too surprisingly, the lefty was a Liberal. I personally am still a little undecided as to where I stand on the line of politics, but I can tell you that I think that "The Right Honourable Jack Layton" would be a good title for him.

As for Tommy Douglas, personally, I think he is an absolute must, since, like you mentioned, he was the father of Canadian Medicare.

About Gilley from the Bloc, well, the only reason I put him as a New Democrat was because the Bloc is basically a Quebec version of the NDP. I'll eemove it if it really bothers you.

Mooghead: Yes, Bill would be awesome, but the economy would plummet faster than a two ton ball from one mm off the ground.

By the way, thanks to the both of you for answering on both of the "political" threads I have posted so far. Your satire and wisdom both give me knowledge.

MadTheSwine73 wrote: As for the best, I agree with you when you say that Jack would have been the best PM we never had. I've only met 2 people that said that they wouldn't want him as PM. One a right-wing extremist, and one a left-wing extremist. Not too surprisingly, the lefty was a Liberal. I personally am still a little undecided as to where I stand on the line of politics, but I can tell you that I think that "The Right Honourable Jack Layton" would be a good title for him.  ================================== Pffft.  Career politician who could yammer on about whatever knowing his policies and promises would never, ever be put to any real test at a federal level.  Put a total neophyte in charge so he could smoothly reclaim the reins of power if he survived his illness, which he was well less than forthcoming about to say the least.   Now the NDP's fortunes are predictably falling in Quebec where they posted all their gains in the first place, and neither opposition party has a permanent leader or a clear direction with which to effectively stand up to the bully government we have.  The media still goes to Bob Rae for opposition comment event though the NDP is the official opposition. LOL  All utterly predictable, just like every political speech Jack Layton ever made.  How ironic that the traditional third party so important to the conscience of the country and the political system may have been the one to put a bullet in the three party system through their own brand of hubris and political greed. Micheal Ignatieff who somewhat  inexplicably didn't even make your list (and perhaps somewhat more explicably neither did Stephane Dion) had an excellent piece in the G & M last week.

Ignatieff as PM? Sure, he's smart, but I'd never want to see that. As for Dion, well, personally, I like him, and I think he would have done a good job as PM, but the reason he didn't make the list is... You know what, I think I might have just skipped it.

Oops! I'll add him in when I get the chance :)

As for Layton, I would have only wanted him as PM under a minority government.
The NDP support is fading here in Quebec; if for some reason a by-election is to be taken place, I'm sure another Bloc seat would get it. Pity, but I'm sure Gilles is loving it.

I just now realized that I only had one Liberal added to the list. I'm going to now re-do it, with insight from you two, and maybe Moog.

I just want to remind you all that I'm only 14, so who knows, maybe tomorrow I'll become a right-wing conservative, and the day after, a left-wing extremist New Democrat.

MadTheSwine73 wrote:

About Gilley from the Bloc, well, the only reason I put him as a New Democrat was because the Bloc is basically a Quebec version of the NDP. I'll eemove it if it really bothers you.

====================

I personally don't have any stake in the outcome, so feel free to say whatever you'd like.  But for the sake of accuracy, the distinction needs to be made because they are two completely different parties.  They both lean to the left, but that's where the similarities end.  The Bloc only ran candidates in one province, so nothing they did acted in the interest of the rest of the country.

And I use past tense because the Bloc doesn't even have official party status anymore.  They're now irrelevant, and thank goodness.  The one truly good thing about the last election is that Quebec turned out to be part of Canada after all.

GratefulFan wrote: >>Pffft.  Career politician who could yammer on about whatever knowing his policies and promises would never, ever be put to any real test at a federal level.<< For someone as articulate and level-headed as yourself, I'm really disappointed to hear such baseless partisan drivel coming from you. >>Put a total neophyte in charge so he could smoothly reclaim the reins of power if he survived his illness, which he was well less than forthcoming about to say the least.<< How could he have possibly been more open about it?  Show pictures of his ultrasounds?  His job was to serve his country, not provide his health records. The list of things Layton accomplished as Toronto councilor and NDP leader is very lengthy.  His biggest legislative accomplishment should have been his 2009 environmental bill that would have made Canada a world leader on the subject.  After passing through the house (i.e. the people we elect), the largely unelected (i.e. hand-picked by Harper) senate shut it down with no debate.  This is the first time such a thing ever happened in the country's history. The liberals and conservatives have sold out our sovereignty to the US over the last 50 years (everything from the recent wheat board deal to NAFTA to the Avro Arrow).  Every piece of legislation that goes through our house is run by the white house first.  The only chance of this country re-establishing its autonomy is if the NDP get a majority, and stand up to the US to loosen the corporate stranglehold they have on our system.  But obviously this won't be any time soon.  The average joe isn't ready for social equity, balance of wealth, environmental sustainability and civil political discourse. If Layton's style of politics never thrives in this country, then the people of Canada only have themselves to blame.

MadTheSwine73 wrote:

I just want to remind you all that I'monly 14, so who knows, maybe tomorrow I'll become a right-wing conservative, and the day after, a left-wing extremist New Democrat.

====================

Good on you for wanting to learn.  And if I may say so, you still have plenty to learn.  First of all, the NDP are no longer left-wing extremists.  Maybe they were a decade ago, but Layton moved them closer to the centre.  He made the NDP much more accessible, which explains their 67 seat gain in the last election.  Their brand of politics is "social democracy," which is centre-left:  a mixed market system (both private and public sectors), and a bottom line that consists not only of money, but also social equity and environmental sustainability (the "triple bottom line" as Layton called it).

This is the style of politics used in much of Europe - the part that's thriving, anyway.  Countries like Austria, Holland, Belgium, Sweden, Norway and Finland have had centre-left governments for decades.  Most of them are world leaders in the areas of environment and social equity.  This is the style of politics that Jack Layton seeked to emulate, but the people of Canada just weren't ready for it.  We are still in the fear tactic and attack ad stage, and showing little signs of moving forward.

All I can suggest to you is read.  Read lots.  Read all the different news sources.  And talk to people of all stripes.  Listen with interest, even if you disagree with them.  The one thing you'll come to see is most people have absolutely no clue what they're talking about when it comes to politics.  Most people just remember what attack ads say, or propaganda spread by parties that stand much to gain from it.  Still, find common ground with people you disagree with instead of pointing out where you differ.  It's the best way to reaffirm your own beliefs.

Even if you're not from Ontario, this is an excellent place to start - http://votecompass.cbc.ca/en

The Real Wizard wrote:

Good on you for wanting to learn. And if I may say so, you still have plenty to learn. First of all, the NDP are no longer left-wing extremists. Maybe they were a decade ago, but Layton moved them closer to the centre. He made the NDP much more accessible, which explains their 67 seat gain in the last election. Their brand of politics is "social democracy," which is centre-left: a mixed market system (both private and public sectors), and a bottom line that consists not only of money, but also social equity and environmental sustainability (the "triple bottom line" as Layton called it).

This is the style of politics used in much of Europe - the part that's thriving, anyway. Countries like Austria, Holland, Belgium, Sweden, Norway and Finland have had centre-left governments for decades. Most of them are world leaders in the areas of environment and social equity. This is the style of politics that Jack Layton seeked to emulate, but the people of Canada just weren't ready for it. We are still in the fear tactic and attack ad stage, and showing little signs of moving forward.

All I can suggest to you is read. Read lots. Read all the different news sources. And talk to people of all stripes. Listen with interest, even if you disagree with them. The one thing you'll come to see is most people have absolutely no clue what they're talking about when it comes to politics. Most people just remember what attack ads say, or propaganda spread by parties that stand much to gain from it. Still, find common ground with people you disagree with instead of pointing out where you differ. It's the best way to reaffirm your own beliefs.

Even if you're not from Ontario, this is an excellent place to start - http://votecompass.cbc.ca/en

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Thanks for the site dude. I took the test, and no joke, it turns out I'm 64% NDP, 64% Liberal, 48& Green, and 44% Conservative. I always thought I was more right-wing than I was left.

Also, thanks fort the support about finding politics interesting!