A.D.

I do not for one instant think that it is some dead person's dream to walk up and down my stairway.
It is proven that most animals only see 'black' and 'white'. Does that mean other colours do not exist? Or, take the dog whistle. Human ears cannot hear the sound. Does the sound therefore not exist? Just because our limited senses cannot perceive something does not mean it does not exist, is not real. Even if we cannot understand any of it.
I do not have an explanation for any of this. I wish I did. All I am saying is there are too many odd and unexplained happenings in this world, and I for one prefer not to close my mind to other possibilities, other realities.

Thanks for sharing your experience, Noorie.

[QUOTE] [b]Chief Mouse wrote:[/b]

Thanks for sharing your experience, Noorie.[/QUOTE]

+1

good to see your name pop up as well noorie. How are you?

^^^ Doin' alright....
How's it going with you? I have a story for you.

[QUOTE] [b]noorie wrote:[/b]

I do not for one instant think that it is some dead person's dream to walk up and down my stairway.
It is proven that most animals only see 'black' and 'white'. Does that mean other colours do not exist? Or, take the dog whistle. Human ears cannot hear the sound. Does the sound therefore not exist? Just because our limited senses cannot perceive something does not mean it does not exist, is not real. Even if we cannot understand any of it.
I do not have an explanation for any of this. I wish I did. All I am saying is there are too many odd and unexplained happenings in this world, and I for one prefer not to close my mind to other possibilities, other realities. [/QUOTE]

These things that we can't perceive are still measurable. And that's because they actually exist. (Or they come into existence WHEN we measure them. Weird.) On the other hand, ghosts, spirits etc., don't exist and that's why not one single, reputable scientist has ever been able to record any evidence of their existence. Take the spiritual and numenist elements out of your argument/belief and I absolutely agree with you: there are many weird things that we don't yet understand, especially in quantum physics. Regarding the footsteps, for example, this theory (outlandish and unproven as it is) might go some way towards explaining it -- but we're still in the realms of science*, not the supernatural.
http://www.nature.com/news/a-quantum-world-arising-from-many-ordinary-ones-1.16213

*or medical science:
“You may be an undigested bit of beef, a blot of mustard, a crumb of cheese, a fragment of underdone potato. There's more of gravy than of grave about you, whatever you are!”
? Charles Dickens, A Christmas Carol

[QUOTE] [b]Holly2003 wrote:[/b]


These things that we can't perceive are still measurable. And that's because they actually exist. (Or they come into existence WHEN we measure them. Weird.) On the other hand, ghosts, spirits etc., don't exist and that's why not one single, reputable scientist has ever been able to record any evidence of their existence. Take the spiritual and numenist elements out of your argument/belief and I absolutely agree with you: there are many weird things that we don't yet understand, especially in quantum physics. Regarding the footsteps, for example, this theory (outlandish and unproven as it is) might go some way towards explaining it -- but we're still in the realms of science*, not the supernatural.
http://www.nature.com/news/a-quantum-world-arising-from-many-ordinary-ones-1.16213

*or medical science:
“You may be an undigested bit of beef, a blot of mustard, a crumb of cheese, a fragment of underdone potato. There's more of gravy than of grave about you, whatever you are!”
? Charles Dickens, A Christmas Carol[/QUOTE]

Today's 'woo woo' is tomorrow's quantum physics.

Of course, 'ghosts' don't exist, simply because that is just a term and fantasy human beings have coined for some kind of energy we do not yet understand. Does not mean the energy does not exist.

When you wrote (Or they come into existence WHEN we measure them. Weird.), you hit the nail on the head. Perhaps the paranormal does not exist for some people, because so far science has not found the correct way to record it...?

Some interesting stuff here: http://www.collective-evolution.com/2015/10/22/the-top-8-paranormal-scientific-studies-what-we-can-learn-from-them/
And here: http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread939300/pg1

I am not trying to convince anybody. Just saying my mind is open to all possibilities.

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Shakespeare - Hamlet. :)

Sorry, things have gone a bit 'weird' and I got crazy triple posts.

Triple post deleted!

[QUOTE] [b]Chief Mouse wrote:[/b]

Thanks for sharing your experience, Noorie.[/QUOTE]

Chief Mouse, I just wanted to say I looove your You Tube channel. Great stuff!

Very good post, noorie.

[QUOTE]

[b]noorie wrote: [/b] [QUOTE] [b]Chief Mouse wrote:[/b]

Thanks for sharing your experience, Noorie.[/QUOTE]

Chief Mouse, I just wanted to say I looove your You Tube channel. Great stuff![/QUOTE]

:)

[QUOTE] [b]matt z wrote:[/b]

What do you believe occurs after death? [/QUOTE]

It's an absolutely pointless discussion to have. What someone thinks will happen has absolutely no bearing on reality - nor are we able to understand even a remote fraction of the possibilities.

But if we base our views on our understandings of the observable universe - the answer is nothing. Although Buddhists may have a slight point if they argue for reincarnation, as the big bang theory suggests that the number of particles in the universe has not changed since then; only their distribution has.

Beyond that, this is a discussion mainly for people who have a need for cognitive closure. But I'm an empirical rationalist, so I'm sure there are literally billions of people (many of whom are highly educated) who will disagree with me. But as far as I'm concerned, there are plenty of other things that actually do exist and actually are verifiable by evidence that far more worthy of our time than a topic that amounts to little more than ghost stories and unverifiable opinions.

Our ancestors turned to superstition because they had no other option. But we should know better.

^Wizard - yes, you are right, in a way, of course. What happens after death is unknowable, and will probably always be so. And, as you say, it is very likely that nothing happens after death.

However there is still to be gained from discussing the matter from a philosophical point of view. This is why it is, and has been, one of the most popular philosophical questions, with greats like Plato having gone into the matter at length. As you say, it's a matter of cognitive closure.

I take a certain twisted solace in knowing that one day all this will be gone. It helps to put things into perspective, and puts people who think or feel that they have achieved some sort of authority which they can exercise over others, into their place. We'll all kick that bucket one day, and nothing really matters that much, because it's all finite, and none of us will last more than 60 or 70 more years at most. When I find myself worrying about some fucker at work, or some cunt on the road, or some arsehole intruding anywhere else in life, I just think about that, and it makes me feel better immediately.

In a way I pity the Christian Cretins, told that they will have to suffer in this life, but they should worry not, because heavenly joy awaits them in the other life. Or the Islamist Extremists, told that they unfortunately do have to wear that wonderful suit, full to the brim with bombs, but they ought to fear not, because the moment they press that button, they're going to be met with the sight of several virgins, all salivating for them. Who the hell wants a virgin anyway, give me an experienced hag any day, they're much more fun.

We've only got this life folks, forget the bullshit. Drink, travel, learn, love and be merry, and thank your luck that you don't live in some part of the world where doing most of those things is near impossible.

[QUOTE] [b]Costa86 wrote:[/b]

However there is still to be gained from discussing the matter from a philosophical point of view.[/QUOTE]
Could you or someone else rationally explain what this value is in the 21st century? I've always wanted to understand it, but nobody has ever had a good enough reason so far.

[QUOTE]I take a certain twisted solace in knowing that one day all this will be gone. It helps to put things into perspective, and puts people who think or feel that they have achieved some sort of authority which they can exercise over others, into their place.[/QUOTE]
Me too. I cannot possibly convey how happy the BBC series "Life After People" makes me. That within a few hundred years every other creature on this planet will thrive whilst no longer having to endure our selfish interference makes me ever so happy. But also sad, because it took us literally billions of years to evolve to this place of higher thought and industrialization, and only a few short centuries for it to unravel because we just weren't quite bright enough. By far, it is the most tragic story that ever will be told.

[QUOTE]In a way I pity the Christian Cretins, told that they will have to suffer in this life, but they should worry not, because heavenly joy awaits them in the other life.[/QUOTE]
Not only do I pity them, but this mentality continues to hold back human progress as it did for about a thousand years en masse. There is no shortage of people who don't give a fuck about the environment, social issues, or whatever else may actually matter because they're convinced without evidence that this is a dress rehearsal, and that a better life awaits them in some place that isn't on a map and doesn't exist. But - baby steps. At least we aren't burning people at the stake anymore because they disagree with us. We just write on forums like this one.

[QUOTE]We've only got this life folks, forget the bullshit. Drink, travel, learn, love and be merry, and thank your luck that you don't live in some part of the world where doing most of those things is near impossible.[/QUOTE]
Amen (in an ecumenical, non-denominational way).

Me personally ...I just let it come to me, and I will see ( or more likely not) what I will get...

My suggestions to the big religions...they should sell mor sex !
Look I do own this fat Buddah figure...nothing is suspicious...

...except it`s in the corner for the food storage ( fruits /culinary herbs etc.)