As it began ' or any other books

MHZ. I agree about IHOW and to see things from the archives.

I just read this quote from IHOW. Made me laugh. Can just hear him saying this. Haha.

I can talk about all kinds of things–like dirt and filth. I think I get on with most people. I’m sure I’d even get on with King Kong very well. We’re the same age. Mind you, I’ve climbed higher buildings than that!

I know this is an unpopular opinion, but I liked the movie even less the 2nd time :(. My husband watched it with me this time and we didn’t get half way through before he said “I’m sorry, but I can’t watch this. Queen has always been a feel good band to me and this movie is depressing. Plus, I don’t think Freddie was a deviant or desperately lonely like they’re portraying him”. Now, my husband never says anything bad about anything, especially if he knows how much I like someone or something so I was a little shocked. I tell you all this because I felt so relieved that I wasn’t alone and we turned it off. Now, my kids got a different take on the movie and enjoyed it a lot more so I don’t know if it’s just us but, I just couldn’t. I did enjoy the cameos, the music and MHZ, so spot on about Gwillym!!!! Oh, we did fast forward to live aid because that part is so good.

JB, awesome quote! That’s the snarky Freddie I love!!

MHZ, yes, definitely stick to the books by Peter Freestone, David Evans/Minns and Jim Hutton. Check out Phoebe’s blog (if u haven’t already) for more details and truth that you don’t get in those other “biographies”. And, of course, Thor and Lee’s book when it comes out!!

You know, it seems like maybe those of us that are harder core fans that know a lot about Freddie and the band are less fans of the movie. I’m not sure why really, I get that it’s a movie and they have to change timelines and dramatize a bit, so I don’t expect perfect portrayal. But maybe because I have read so much and seen interviews I just don’t need to see anything that is not the actual people involved. Funny thing, my husband is not a Queen fan in any way, but I dragged him with me to the movie and he loved it! It shocked me, to be honest, that he loved it so much. So maybe for those that don’t know all the background info the movie is a good representation and they learn what Freddie went through.

I have read Peter Freestone’s books and blogs, and also Jim’s book. I really enjoyed Phoebe’s stuff, although maybe a little more detail on the layout of the house and the table settings than I needed, lol! Jim’s book was ok, I was uncomfortable with all the intimate stuff, and I felt like he came across as pretty bitter about a lot of stuff. But it did have some good info too. I am curious, what parts of the other biographies are not true? Just generally, I always wonder when people say that what parts have been embellished or made up.

You may be right MHZ! Or, in my case, I’m just used to Freddie and don’t like the change so much. I’m glad though that a lot of people did enjoy it and it really exposed a whole new generation to a band who may not have been familiar with their music!!

I agree with Phoebes books and the home descriptions. A lot of that is just that I don’t have a good imagination though, I really need to see things to “get it” sometimes. I also get what you mean about Jim’s book, I just tried to keep in mind that someone wrote it for him and probably included stuff that came up in conversation that Jim didn’t realize would be printed. I don’t feel he was bitter though, I think he was just being honest, open and trying to give the writer a total sense of what life was like with Freddie, good and bad. I trust the people less who seem to only show one side because it makes me wonder what they might be hiding. And, if you take FM’s words to heart, he wanted his story told “warts and all”.

As far as other biographies, there are so many things that have been proven false, idk if I could remember them all. A couple big things that come to mind are all the stories about John Murphy and Gaeten Dugan being the ones to give FM AIDS, the fact that he NEVER met Princess Diana and snuck her into gay bars or that Freddie had a relationship with Rudolph Nureyev. I saw a book listed on Amazon and the blurb mentioned that that false relationship caused the death of those two and ALL of the NY daughters. You probably didn’t want me to write a small novel here so I’ll just stop now lol!

No worries about writing a novel, I figured there were probably a bunch! But I do feel good that I knew those were false, so I think I have a grasp on what types of things were wrong in the books. I just didn’t want to feel super-clueless!

I think for me the part of Jim’s book that seemed most bitter was the being kicked out of Garden Lodge part. In Phoebe’s follow-up book he explains (and I also saw him explain this in an interview, i’m thinking one of the question/answer sessions from either a convention or Freddie’s birthday celebration) that they had to leave Garden Lodge not because Mary suddenly got mean, but because the probate court required no one to be in the house while they settled things. Apparently they could not have people coming in and out potentially taking things of value that were part of the estate that would have to be settled. They have to do complete inventories and value all property in settling things. So Mary didn’t randomly kick them out against Freddie’s wishes. No tenants are allowed in that kind of situation. It’s possible Jim didn’t understand that, but since Phoebe did and holds no ill will against Mary for it then it’s hard to believe Jim didn’t know. And throughout the book Jim makes negative comments about Mary. And trust me, I don’t want to start a Jim vs. Mary discussion, lol! Personally, I don’t know which Freddie preferred or held at higher regard or whatever, and we will never know so I don’t spend time thinking one way or the other. I just don’t like it when someone takes shots at another person in a book, and that other person (Mary) has never publicly said anything negative about them (Jim). Just my reasoning behind the impression of Jim being somewhat bitter!

MHZ, unfortunately, there is so much out there, true and false, we are all kind of clueless still! I feel as if there are many stories/truths still out there that people like Phoebe don't/won't talk about out of respect for Freddie's memory and legacy and those he left behind. I totally respect that!!!

I don't venture into too much about Jim/Mary due to the backlash on both sides. I feel as if there are certain truths we can count on because we saw/heard about them from reliable sources. Freddie said he was gay, to everyone. If he wanted to be with Mary, not Jim, he would've been. While he hid truths to the public behind snark and sarcasm, he lived his private life honestly as much as he could. Mary was a very trusted friend, otherwise, he would've gotten her out of his life. After the death of a loved one, many people feel anger, hurt, confusion, etc. I'm sure those were very painful/confusing times for EVERYONE. I don't fault Phoebe and Jim for being a little bitter but they both reached out to Mary later to check on her and try to keep in touch so, whatever bad feelings surfaced, for whatever reason, they seem to have moved beyond it. I also feel as if we have to remember these were very different times, gay people were still being strongly persecuted, didn't have full legal rights in regards to many things like wills/probate so it's very possible that contributed to the confusion/feelings at the time.

There are so many undisputed stories out there about Freddie's generosity and love, those are what people should focus on instead of taking a "side" and getting so angry.

Thank you Amidds, it is nice to have a rational discussion on this!??. I feel the same, Freddie was gay (or bi, either way) and he had both Jim and Mary in his life and obviously loved them both, albeit in different ways as time went on. I can definitely see why the guys may have been a little bitter towards Mary if they reached out to her and didn’t get the response they thought they would. I imagine it had to be so awkward for all of them after Freddie passed, dealing with the pain and struggling to know how to handle things with the center of their group now gone. I could see Mary feeling badly about having them leave Garden Lodge, but perhaps thinking they held her responsible, so she was reluctant to speak with them for fear of backlash. It is easy for shyer people to retreat to silence then to embrace others. But again, I am just making assumptions so who knows how things really unfolded and how they felt? I respect all of them so much for keeping Freddie’s things private and also having to juggle the public’s thirst to know everything. It has to be such a difficult juggling act!

Good conversation happening.
Amidds. So well said!

While I’m still waiting to re-check out AIB, thought I’d throw this out from my notes:


AIB Pg 86-87. Anyone come across any indication that Freddie chose jeans and tank for live-aid taking in to consideration American viewers? I always love and admire how well thought out and intentional they are/have been. :)

I've only read AIB (I have the first print, signed as well) and I'm happy with that.
I'm getting more and more fed up with those claiming to "know it all and know it better". Nah, not for me thanks

LilyA — that’s really cool that you have a signed first print... that’s amazing!!!

We are enjoying reading and discussing the details. So much great info in it!

86-87 does not mention live aid just made me curious..... :))

LilyA - gotta say, I'm pretty jealous you have an original signed copy! I have to keep checking it out of the library and who knows how long they're gonna let me do that!!

JB-thanks for the clarification with the page numbers. I couldn't find a Live Aid reference and was thinking we must have 2 different versions lol!! I think you may be onto something - lots of quotes from Freddie regarding how much thought he put into performances. What is that saying about when nothing is left give them fashion??? I know I have that wrong......

When I was looking for your reference though, I came across this in my notes..."His throat problems might have rendered Freddie speechless between shows but certainly didn't reduce him to helplessness, as an unlucky lady thief found out in Seattle. Freddie disturbed her in his hotel room pocketing his money and jewelry and gave chase. She was apprehended and arrested in the lobby". I think IHOW follows this story up with a quote about him yelling at her that she was a tart! I love that story! I could almost see him jumping on her and knocking her down like he did to Kenny Everett lol!!

MHZ - I feel it is important for everyone to have their own opinion and hope we can all share ours without being reduced to idiots when expressing them!!! Hopefully this thread remains a safe space for that.....

Amidds— HAHA!! That was such a great story. So true, can just visualize that. Now I’ll search my kindle IHOW for that quote. “Gotta” love Kindle search. :))

Ohh great quote! If memory serves, I remember seeing that in a few places, think one was Thor’s story and other may have been an interview. I’ll look for it. :))

Amidds- I found it...here is the beginning of the quote from IHOW—

“In America, we seemed dogged by bad luck. On tour there in 1975, a young American tart got into my hotel room and pilfered my jewels and bracelets. She was just evacuating the room when I accosted her by the elevator. I pulled her by the hair, dragged her back into the room, emptied the contents of her bag...”

YES - that's the one! My memory isn't the best for details but I do know when something sounds familiar. I literally laughed out loud again reading that!