John Edwards...

Oh to be young and idealistic. I forgot how futile it can be to discuss liberal ideology with youth.

As much as I would have agreed with you all years ago, I have discovered that not everyone can live in an ideal world. If you lean too far to the Left, then that leaves the center open for the Right to claim. Keep in mind that the majority of people are centrist by nature and do not want to upset the status quo. Democrats, in order to survive especially as their party decreases in numbers, need to embrace the middle more than they do, and it's not that hard (exhibit one - Bill Clinton).

As for Dean's ideas for Health Care, I suggest you also peruse Clark's, Kerry's, and Edwards' policies and you'll notice they are not that different. As a matter of fact, I doubt there is a Democrat that opposes univerisal health care to some extent.

And finally, Margo without the T, I really don't follow your argument one bit, particularly the "lose-lose" argument. Care to try that again?

LOL Zeni. Is it McGovern part 2? Will history repeat itself. Will a candidate of dubious ethics again be re-elected because an un-electable democratic candidate will win the primary? Why must a far right president be diametrically opposed by a far left candidate? Bush is ripe for the picking, but the Democratic Party seems more intent on trying to win the lotto with an unelectable far left candidate rather than someone who can win the election by getting popular support.

They need to embrace the middle more than they do? How much more can they do that?

There is a reason I generally don't like Democrats any more than I do Republicans. I don't feel I can support a person who shares about 30% of my views, even if they are running against someone who shares about 10%. I will support Edwards if he wins the nomination, but I won't be happy about it.

I like Dean because he's not afraid. He's not afraid to run afoul of many of these people who call themselves the "middle" (among them are John Kerry, Joe Lieberman, George Bush, Newt Gingrich, Bill O'Reilly, William Safire, Alan Colmes, and Charles Krauthammer - for every one of them except Colmes, that's a real laugh). The middle has quite enough representation in the world. Everything, at least in my neck of the woods, is done to please the conservatives and/or the "middle". Southern liberals in particular should be supporting Howard Dean - this man knows what he wants for America, and he's not afraid to say it out loud, rather than shrink back into a corner and let Karl Rove run his campaign.

I haven't ever found a presidential canidate that I gave a damn about... This year is no different.

My family's voting for Bush, but presidents don't really do much so I don't really care either way.

I just hope we don't get Dean and pull out of Iraq and end up having the country go down the tubes again.

Dean has yet to win me over-try as I may to like the guy- there always is a nagging voice that says 'whoa boy'
he has flipped flopped on many issues
greenspan being the latest-
so for me the jury is still out on this one

a good read on the democratic party these days is zell millers book-interesting to see what a life long no budge democrat has to say


flip a coin time

OK Zeni- Ill try again.

There are 7 Democratic candidates left. They are all running on different tickets, but the main issue is defeating Bush. Now, I'm for beating Bush as much as the next bleading-heart liberal. However, I don't want a candidate that doen't represent most of my views (like Mandy said). Getting a "middle of the road" candidate may beat Bush, but also won't represent most of the liberal's views in an effort to please both parties. What will end up happening is that Republicans won't like the president, because he's a Democrat. Democrats won't like him because he's too much like a Republican. See- no one wins. no one has a candidate that they really want- the election becomes a lesser of two evils decision. I want a candidate that I can support because s/he has the same views as me and will try to get bills passed that support what I believe in. I don't want a candidate that I support simply because s/he's not a Republican.

Is that clearer?

"Democrats won't like him because he's too much like a Republican."

You assume that all Democrats are to the far Left, and if that were the case, the perhaps what you say is true.

Fortunately, many Demcocrats in Congress are more realistic, and the idea that they won't work with the new President, which would only handicap them, make them useless, and open for defeat by Republicans, is incorrect. Democrats in Congress will happily work with the Democratic President, at least for a time being, simply because he is not Bush.

And I agree with Eagle: Dean puts me off but I have yet to find a candidate who I support fully.

It might be true that it's the right thing to keep the balance between the left and right. Both extremes of either one are not good.

But it's absolutely true that Republicans are more leaned to the 'extreme right wing' than Democrats to the 'extreme left wing', and that's why I don't trust Republicans.

Zeni, I never said that congress wouldn't work with the president if he's middle of the road. I said that they (and the rest of the population) wouldn't like him as much as someone, who say, agreed with them.

On a lighter note,

Am I the only one that thought that Dean's shouting last week in Iowa reminded of Old School WWF shouting matches?!

WRESTLEMANIA!

So the New Hampshire results will be tomrrow, who will win?

I think it would be Kerry again.

Sega, Dean's not in favor of pulling out of Iraq. He actually wants to fix things. You're thinking of Kucinich, hon.

rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu
ready..................
to........
rumble..........

Dean:

GRRRRRRRRRRRR

YOU ARE NEXT HULK HOGAN! RANDY SAVAGE! GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

SEE YOU AT WRESTLEMANIA!

lol- a MUCH lighter note.

I don't think Dean'll be doing Wrestlemania anytime soon....