Sebastian...Once more you Save the day! I don't know why Scott always dismisses Freddies...and John's, Brian's, Roger's talents or abilities if it doesn't jive with what he WANTS to think they were ONLY capable of. And he constantly corrects zoners about facts that HE is wrong about.
I don't think anyone is 100% an authority, and anyone can interpret certain theories, but at leastyou have an open mind to the talents and skills of each Queen member, and you do your research 1st...and still you leave things open...to possibility, plus when you quote what music artists say..you then add you're own..."But just because that music artist said or sisn't say it does or doesn't make it necessarily so".
Thanks S!
Thread
Posts in chronological order
So many points to reply to, so little time...
Scott: You need to educate yourself a little about piano playing before making such forthright statements about pianists and their level of virtuosity. And as Sebastian mentioned, you need to make the distinction between somebody's technique on the piano, and their ability to write good/popular music on the piano.
Freddie is NOT on a par with JLL, EJ and BJ. No way. I can say that with absolute certainty, despite not being particularly well versed in the music of those 3 mentioned.
Fred was really very limited in the range of his piano playing styles, and in the notes he used. EJ, BJ and JLL have a greater range of technique than Fred, and so are technically better pianists.
And I have to confess to knowing fuck all about Liberace and his music, but again I can categorically state that he would never ever be considered anything like a 10 on the virtuoso scale. I've no idea how good he is, but I know he's not a virtuoso, because if he was I would know it.
Monk, I do know. You obviously have limited knowledge of jazz, because otherwise you'd know that Monk is all about his WEIRD technique and weird harmony/melody/arrangement, rather than his sheer out-and-out ability to play the piano. Again, we're only talking about technique in the purest sense here, because many regard Monk as a genius, but none (apart from you) would call him a virtuoso on the piano. Try Art Tatum for 10 out of 10 on the virtuoso scale.
Your 'name a handful of Liberace and Monk hits' comment is entirely irrelevant when we're discussing pianistic virtuosity, i.e. technique. There does not have to be, and very very very rarely is, a direct correlation between being technically proficient and being commerically successful, as you should know.
Xcess Queen: Thanks for not giving a shit what I have to say. I'll bear your opinion in mind before I post next time.
Concering your question: Sebastian already responded that she was referring to Mike Moran (I don't know if this is true or not, but he is an excellent pianist), but even if she was referring to Fred, there was no risk, nor demand for an excellent player. All she would need is a competent pianist that could play Barcelona on piano. Fred could certainly do that, as it's not a particularly challenging piece to play.
And as Fred COULD play it, she would be simply being polite in demanding that Fred play at the premiere, seeing as he co-wrote the song, would be performing it, and was her 'partner' for the occasion. But anyway, it's a moot point.
Moet et Chandon: I don't really understand the point(s) you were making with your illustrations to me.
In the piano world (and again, when measuring virtuosity, you can only really talk about TECHNIQUE) you have virtuosos who play jazz and improvise, and you have virtuosos who play classical music and sight-read. You have those that can do one and not the other, and you have those that can do both (who are generally more jazz-orientated). So what? I don't see that your illustration proves anything.
In your first example, the German guy could be called a virtuoso who can't improvise particularly well. Fair enough, but he's still a virtuoso.
In your second example you have somebody with little or no natural ability, but who worked at playing music and is now an accomplished musician. Again, so what?
I'm not belittling your comments; I love talking about this stuff. I just don't see the relation between your comments and what I perceive to be the topic at hand.
Nobody is doubting that Fred was approaching (and I hate to use this word for fear of sounding Stepfordian) genius with some of his compositions on the piano, but that's entirely different to him being a brilliant piano player, which he wasn't.
And so endeth possibly my longest post ever...
Scott: You need to educate yourself a little about piano playing before making such forthright statements about pianists and their level of virtuosity. And as Sebastian mentioned, you need to make the distinction between somebody's technique on the piano, and their ability to write good/popular music on the piano.
Freddie is NOT on a par with JLL, EJ and BJ. No way. I can say that with absolute certainty, despite not being particularly well versed in the music of those 3 mentioned.
Fred was really very limited in the range of his piano playing styles, and in the notes he used. EJ, BJ and JLL have a greater range of technique than Fred, and so are technically better pianists.
And I have to confess to knowing fuck all about Liberace and his music, but again I can categorically state that he would never ever be considered anything like a 10 on the virtuoso scale. I've no idea how good he is, but I know he's not a virtuoso, because if he was I would know it.
Monk, I do know. You obviously have limited knowledge of jazz, because otherwise you'd know that Monk is all about his WEIRD technique and weird harmony/melody/arrangement, rather than his sheer out-and-out ability to play the piano. Again, we're only talking about technique in the purest sense here, because many regard Monk as a genius, but none (apart from you) would call him a virtuoso on the piano. Try Art Tatum for 10 out of 10 on the virtuoso scale.
Your 'name a handful of Liberace and Monk hits' comment is entirely irrelevant when we're discussing pianistic virtuosity, i.e. technique. There does not have to be, and very very very rarely is, a direct correlation between being technically proficient and being commerically successful, as you should know.
Xcess Queen: Thanks for not giving a shit what I have to say. I'll bear your opinion in mind before I post next time.
Concering your question: Sebastian already responded that she was referring to Mike Moran (I don't know if this is true or not, but he is an excellent pianist), but even if she was referring to Fred, there was no risk, nor demand for an excellent player. All she would need is a competent pianist that could play Barcelona on piano. Fred could certainly do that, as it's not a particularly challenging piece to play.
And as Fred COULD play it, she would be simply being polite in demanding that Fred play at the premiere, seeing as he co-wrote the song, would be performing it, and was her 'partner' for the occasion. But anyway, it's a moot point.
Moet et Chandon: I don't really understand the point(s) you were making with your illustrations to me.
In the piano world (and again, when measuring virtuosity, you can only really talk about TECHNIQUE) you have virtuosos who play jazz and improvise, and you have virtuosos who play classical music and sight-read. You have those that can do one and not the other, and you have those that can do both (who are generally more jazz-orientated). So what? I don't see that your illustration proves anything.
In your first example, the German guy could be called a virtuoso who can't improvise particularly well. Fair enough, but he's still a virtuoso.
In your second example you have somebody with little or no natural ability, but who worked at playing music and is now an accomplished musician. Again, so what?
I'm not belittling your comments; I love talking about this stuff. I just don't see the relation between your comments and what I perceive to be the topic at hand.
Nobody is doubting that Fred was approaching (and I hate to use this word for fear of sounding Stepfordian) genius with some of his compositions on the piano, but that's entirely different to him being a brilliant piano player, which he wasn't.
And so endeth possibly my longest post ever...
Xcess Queen: Thanks for not giving a shit what I have to say. I'll bear your opinion in mind before I post next time.
I didn't write: "I don't give a shit".
I wrote: "I don't give a ****".
And I've meant: "I don't give a FUCK".
Ahh, I see. Well that changes things then, whilst at the same time adding something constructive to the debate.
Thanks.
Thanks.
i am a pianist myself-grade 6-i play lots of queen on he piano and also lots of elton john. i have to say that eltons john pieces are a lot more difficult but are no way as interesting or as memorable as queen pieces.
fredde was one of the best at writing memorable piano riffs that you recognise straight away. o one can touch for that, not even elton. someone said that freddie mainly does chords in the right hand and octave bass notes in the left. i totally disagree. elton john does this a lot more that freddie which makes his playing less memorable
As far as the rock songs on piano, Fred did right by playing just enough to make the song work. Songs like Love Of My Life, however, the song is a piano piece and all other instruments cater to the piano. Bickering over Freddie's level of piano playing is pointless because we all obvioulsy love it. Otherwise, the forum topics would consisit of "I wish Freddie would stop using piano in their songs" and things of that nature. There are no two people that play exactly the same on any instrument and that's the beauty of music. If Freddie and Brian played the same, there would be no reason for one or the other to switch in songwriting. Environment has a lot to do with a person's "feel" on an instrument. People have mentioned Billy Joel and Thelonious Monk and their style but much of their playing is a direct correllation with their blues and jazz environment. The simple fact is Freddie knew what chords sound good together and his real talent is in songwriting (Crazy Little Thing Called Love). He was by no means a great guitarist but he knew what chords sounded good together to write a simple yet fantastic song. Brian was the same on the piano. Except I think Brian may have had to work a little harder to write piano songs since he is a much more methodical songwriter. Just my opinion but a good topic.
It's a quite interesting topic going on here. The most interesting I've seen here in a while.
I totally agree with all of you who have been admiring Freddie's pianoplaying.
I think I hear a similarity between Freddie's voice and his pianoplaying. And between Brian's voice and pianoplaying. I don't excacly know how to explain that.. but it is true.. Freddie has a great and extraordinary voice, and also extraordinary piano playing. He might not be the best pianoplayer.. i bet he couldn't take some hard sheet music by Mozart or something and play it technicaly perfect.... But he has something that is more rarer and more important than any techinic in the world. He gives his sole to the piano and people can feel that.
That's what I'm taught in my piano class... Feel the music. You don't have to do all the things that is writtin.. just feel it and think about it. And the audience will feel it too.
Music can be a mirror of the player's soul.
And I've never heard anyone who has that much of this talent as Freddie.
Brian is a good pianoplayer.. but it seem like he can't show his emotions that much like Freddie as he shows it in his guitar. But he has also a little bit of that talent in himself.
It's just like his voice... smooth and easy, but not extraordinary.
I totally agree with all of you who have been admiring Freddie's pianoplaying.
I think I hear a similarity between Freddie's voice and his pianoplaying. And between Brian's voice and pianoplaying. I don't excacly know how to explain that.. but it is true.. Freddie has a great and extraordinary voice, and also extraordinary piano playing. He might not be the best pianoplayer.. i bet he couldn't take some hard sheet music by Mozart or something and play it technicaly perfect.... But he has something that is more rarer and more important than any techinic in the world. He gives his sole to the piano and people can feel that.
That's what I'm taught in my piano class... Feel the music. You don't have to do all the things that is writtin.. just feel it and think about it. And the audience will feel it too.
Music can be a mirror of the player's soul.
And I've never heard anyone who has that much of this talent as Freddie.
Brian is a good pianoplayer.. but it seem like he can't show his emotions that much like Freddie as he shows it in his guitar. But he has also a little bit of that talent in himself.
It's just like his voice... smooth and easy, but not extraordinary.
It's a quite interesting topic going on here. The most interesting I've seen here in a while.
I totally agree with all of you who have been admiring Freddie's pianoplaying.
:)
i'm in no way an expert, i can't even play any instrument but my favourite part of late 70's gigs was the "2legs/killer/loverboy/my car" medley and freddie played piano during that part so there must be something in his playin' that i like ;)
I´m a pianist, and I can tell you that for a rock & roll pianist, Freddie is awesome!!!
I mean, there are a lot of professional pianists such as martha argerich, vladimir ashkenazy, rubinstein, etc etc etc...
but rock 6 roll is quite a different thing... Freddie was a wonderful pianist for what he did...
Besides... he had style... he used to play a "Steinway & Sons" on some tours!!!!
I mean, there are a lot of professional pianists such as martha argerich, vladimir ashkenazy, rubinstein, etc etc etc...
but rock 6 roll is quite a different thing... Freddie was a wonderful pianist for what he did...
Besides... he had style... he used to play a "Steinway & Sons" on some tours!!!!
someone said "Innuendo is my favorite song by Roger Taylor".
As I keep saying...Innuendo has to be Freddie's, because no one else in the band has the knowledge to compose a song with 30+ chords in it, and make it work.
Compare Innuendo to "Fun It"....does that sound like its written by the same person?
No, it doesn't sound.
But, from what I know - Innuendo is Roger's song.
If someone has a proof that I'm wrong, please write it.
I Believe Scott is understimating Roger hability to write songs...
According to Queen, who writes LYRICS should be considered as the author of each song.
Roger wrote 'Innuendo', 'These Are The Days Of Our Lives' and 'Ride The Wild Wind', despite they're credited to Queen.
Everybody knows these facts and only Freddie-obsessed fans (the ones who usually say that Queen was MOSTLY Freddie and nothing more) could keep crediting to Freddie any Queen masterpiece...Just like when i heard that ppl thought that 'The Show Must Go On' was Freddie's work, while it's Brian's.
Roger wrote 'Innuendo', 'These Are The Days Of Our Lives' and 'Ride The Wild Wind', despite they're credited to Queen.
Everybody knows these facts and only Freddie-obsessed fans (the ones who usually say that Queen was MOSTLY Freddie and nothing more) could keep crediting to Freddie any Queen masterpiece...Just like when i heard that ppl thought that 'The Show Must Go On' was Freddie's work, while it's Brian's.
According to Queen, who writes LYRICS should be considered as the author of each song.
Yeah, you're right!
Sebastian explained that Innuendo has to be Freddie's song - but he was talking only about MUSIC! Sebastian may be right about that, but what about the LYRICS???
Sebastian says that Roger was incorrectly credited with writing Innuendo. Roger had a hand in the lyrics (but with Freddie).
Freddie started writing the lyrics, which Roger later finished.
Freddie wrote the music for the entire song, including the flamenco guitar solo.
If you go on Sebastian's website, he discusses that alot of incorrect information has been floating about for years now, as to incorrectly crediting certain members of Queen with the songwriting of certain post AKOM songs to the wrong members of Queen, which now though time consuming...has to be CORRECTED.
And Freddie proabably thought most of Innuendo out on piano.
Freddie started writing the lyrics, which Roger later finished.
Freddie wrote the music for the entire song, including the flamenco guitar solo.
If you go on Sebastian's website, he discusses that alot of incorrect information has been floating about for years now, as to incorrectly crediting certain members of Queen with the songwriting of certain post AKOM songs to the wrong members of Queen, which now though time consuming...has to be CORRECTED.
And Freddie proabably thought most of Innuendo out on piano.