Hello again.
I'm back in the office now after leaving for home yesterday in a hurry. Apparently the police were taking precautionary measures, all the places where people could be collecting -shopping malls, big hotels, etc in and around my locality were evacuated, and every vehicle on the street was stopped and searched. No incidents though, thank GOD.
Well to continue from where I left off yesterday, the curse on the Indian people is the complete lack of sincereity in the political class. The Delhi incident I referred to yesterday was just one example, byt every time an attack happens the asame thing is repeated. Recently there was another incident in which some Hindu terrorists are suspected to have been involved. In this case too, one of the most prominent politicians (who aspires to become the Prime Minister in the next elections) has critisised the harsh treatment meted out to the accused by the investogators during interrogations.
Dear Saif, no point in venting your anger ot Prophet Muhammad. It is the people who are responsible, not the religion itself. The same quotations from the Quran have been interpreted in two different ways. I am a Hindu, but dont hate any one just for being a Muslim; indeed my best friend is a Muslim, that too a female. But I hate every terrorist, no matter which religion.
I don't give a shit what any scripture says, my concern is that I should be able to get on the street without the danger of being blown to pieces.
And I hold the government of our country compeletely responsible for the current situation. They have been extremely soft on terrorists. They keep the police on a leash, they refrain from calling a spade a spade in fear of losing muslim votes. The cops donot even have the bare minimum gear to face the attackers. The initial counter attack by the mumbai cops was a compelete failure purely because of their 19th century training and unifirm. All they had was a service revolver, no proper bullet proof vests and they were facing terrorists armed with AK 47s, night vision glasses and the most advanced bullet proof clothing. Not surprisingly, as soon as the police launched their counter-attack, the officers on the frontline were wiped out! That's when the commandos of the Indian army were called in and they managed to stop the inflitration from expandign further.
Thread
Posts in chronological order
As AspiringPhilosopher says, every religion has a violent history, including Hinduism and even Buddhism (yes!).
That does not make the religion hateful, it is the people who need to be blamed.
I feel the important thing is to acknowledge the existence of the problem by the people of that religion. Nothing irritates me more than people making statements like "islam means peace", "terrorists have no religion", etc. Ofcourse these people are muslims and ofcourse these people are islamic terrorists. The sooner the muslims come to terms with this fact, the better for the country and indeed the world.
That does not make the religion hateful, it is the people who need to be blamed.
I feel the important thing is to acknowledge the existence of the problem by the people of that religion. Nothing irritates me more than people making statements like "islam means peace", "terrorists have no religion", etc. Ofcourse these people are muslims and ofcourse these people are islamic terrorists. The sooner the muslims come to terms with this fact, the better for the country and indeed the world.
My sister's high school friend is actually over there at this very moment, and since she usually doesn't stay with family we became really worried. My sister texted her, but my other sister & I tried urging her to call instead. We're not sure if she has service or is using a different phone... I hope nothing has happened to her though.
[QUOTE]
[b]Saif wrote: [/b]
Yeah, you see, this is EXACTLY why I FUCKING HATE Muslims.
[/QUOTE]
Hoo boy.
[b]Saif wrote: [/b]
Yeah, you see, this is EXACTLY why I FUCKING HATE Muslims.
[/QUOTE]
Hoo boy.
A good friend of mine is actually in Mumbai at the minute for his daughters wedding, we havent heard anything back from him but believe he is ok as apparently no Brits have have been declared missing. He had saved all of his holidays at work and had no time off all year to spend 3 weeks in India, and we are gutted for him. His daughter had her first wedding in the Uk 3 weeks ago and flew over to India to have a second wedding with all of their family, hopefully, with the wedding not until next week, the place should be back to some kind of normality.
[QUOTE]
[b]Saif wrote: [/b]
Yeah, you see, this is EXACTLY why I FUCKING HATE Muslims....
[/QUOTE]
Okie, I think you can stop there and go straight to hell, you fucking racist little cunt.
I have quite a lot of muslim friends, and NONE of them follow the belief you 'described' Islam to be.
What the media is doing is taking a VERY small minority of muslims, who are the incredibly extremist ones, and portraying them as being representative of the majority of muslims worldwide. And you can thank that little fuckwit George Bush for pushing that agenda there, as a lot of Western people have been taking on that false belief as fact.
Even most muslims denounce those terrorists as not being true muslims, since they don't follow the true muslim beliefs as set by the Qu'ran - their equivalent of the Bible.
[b]Saif wrote: [/b]
Yeah, you see, this is EXACTLY why I FUCKING HATE Muslims....
[/QUOTE]
Okie, I think you can stop there and go straight to hell, you fucking racist little cunt.
I have quite a lot of muslim friends, and NONE of them follow the belief you 'described' Islam to be.
What the media is doing is taking a VERY small minority of muslims, who are the incredibly extremist ones, and portraying them as being representative of the majority of muslims worldwide. And you can thank that little fuckwit George Bush for pushing that agenda there, as a lot of Western people have been taking on that false belief as fact.
Even most muslims denounce those terrorists as not being true muslims, since they don't follow the true muslim beliefs as set by the Qu'ran - their equivalent of the Bible.
[QUOTE]
[b]AspiringPhilosophe wrote: [/b]
I beg to differ, Saif.
Islam is not a hateful religion. If it is, then so is Christianity and Judaisim.
The actions that you speak of as being evidence of the hate inside of Islam are the same actions committed by Christians and Jews over the centuries since the development of the religions. Sure there are passages in the Koran that sanction murder and other unspeakable crimes against humanity. But the same passages can be found in Jewish and Christian holy books, particularly the Old Testament of the Bible.
The question isn't of what the text says, but how they are viewed. There are two ways to look at a holy text: Literally and Metaphorically. Those who take the text literally (referred to as fundamentalists) insist that the text means exactly what it says, it should not attempt to be interpreted because interpretation breeds corruption. These are the people who point to the passages that speak to violence, murder, killing and slavery (among others) as being literal prescriptions for the faithful to follow. They are the ones who commit these acts of violence, saying that the holy text says they can do it.
However, except for the noisy and destructive and violent minority, this does not classify the religion. Judaism, Christianity and Islam have adopted the view that the holy texts are more like guidelines that shouldn't be taken literally because they were the product of the people of the time they were written, and society has advanced considerably since their authorship. Christians today don't sell their daughters into slavery or kill their sons for disobeying them (as sanctioned in the Old Testament), and the majority of Muslims don't kills others who refuse to believe as they do.
The noisy, violent minority do not represent the religion. Don't make the mistake of thinking that they do, or all you are doing is perpetuating the hate.
[/QUOTE]
Well put.
[b]AspiringPhilosophe wrote: [/b]
I beg to differ, Saif.
Islam is not a hateful religion. If it is, then so is Christianity and Judaisim.
The actions that you speak of as being evidence of the hate inside of Islam are the same actions committed by Christians and Jews over the centuries since the development of the religions. Sure there are passages in the Koran that sanction murder and other unspeakable crimes against humanity. But the same passages can be found in Jewish and Christian holy books, particularly the Old Testament of the Bible.
The question isn't of what the text says, but how they are viewed. There are two ways to look at a holy text: Literally and Metaphorically. Those who take the text literally (referred to as fundamentalists) insist that the text means exactly what it says, it should not attempt to be interpreted because interpretation breeds corruption. These are the people who point to the passages that speak to violence, murder, killing and slavery (among others) as being literal prescriptions for the faithful to follow. They are the ones who commit these acts of violence, saying that the holy text says they can do it.
However, except for the noisy and destructive and violent minority, this does not classify the religion. Judaism, Christianity and Islam have adopted the view that the holy texts are more like guidelines that shouldn't be taken literally because they were the product of the people of the time they were written, and society has advanced considerably since their authorship. Christians today don't sell their daughters into slavery or kill their sons for disobeying them (as sanctioned in the Old Testament), and the majority of Muslims don't kills others who refuse to believe as they do.
The noisy, violent minority do not represent the religion. Don't make the mistake of thinking that they do, or all you are doing is perpetuating the hate.
[/QUOTE]
Well put.
One other thing I just noted, rather ironically
[QUOTE]Saif
Bohemian: 666 posts
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]Saif
Bohemian: 666 posts
[/QUOTE]
The murder of one man equates to the murder of all humanity, according to the Quran.
These guys aren't exactly going to heaven, says their own religion.
These guys aren't exactly going to heaven, says their own religion.
[b]Ravie wrote - [/b]
My sister's high school friend is actually over there at this very moment, and since she usually doesn't stay with family we became really worried.
[b]Brian_Mays_Wig wrote[/b] -
A good friend of mine is actually in Mumbai at the minute for his daughters wedding, we havent heard anything back from him but believe he is ok as apparently no Brits have have been declared missing.
I hope you two have heard back from your friends?
My sister's high school friend is actually over there at this very moment, and since she usually doesn't stay with family we became really worried.
[b]Brian_Mays_Wig wrote[/b] -
A good friend of mine is actually in Mumbai at the minute for his daughters wedding, we havent heard anything back from him but believe he is ok as apparently no Brits have have been declared missing.
I hope you two have heard back from your friends?
[QUOTE]Islam is not a hateful religion. If it is, then so is Christianity and Judaisim.[/QUOTE]
You know, David Koresh said the same thing about his religion before lighting a match...
You know, David Koresh said the same thing about his religion before lighting a match...
A peaceful protest rally was held at the Gateway of India in Mumbai (a 2 min walk from the Taj Mahal hotel) on wednesday. A lot of people showed up from all over the city holdng banners and shouting slogans.
Well the banner i found the funniest is this one -
Well the banner i found the funniest is this one -
One terrorist was caught alive by the police and the trial has been under-way for more than a month now.
The arrested terrorist (names Kasab, a Pkistani national) had initially pleaded not guilty but surprised oen and all (including his lawyer) by all of a sudden confessing on Monday.
http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20090720/812/tnl-kasab-confesses-to-his-role-in-26-11.html
[QUOTE]
Mon, Jul 20 02:53 PM
Mumbai, July 20 (IANS) In a dramatic twist in the ongoing 26/11 Mumbai terror attacks trial, Pakistani terrorist Mohammed Ajmal Amir alias Kasab Monday confessed to his role in carrying out the Mumbai terror attacks which left 180 persons dead and over 300 injured.
'This is a victory of truth and the confession came all of a sudden in the special court,' said special public prosecutor Ujjwal Nikam.
Nikam also said that Kasab made the confession after discussing the issue with his government appointed lawyer S.G. Abbas Kazmi.
Kasab also admitted that he is a Pakistani national and recounted in detail how he and his associates undertook the sea voyage from Karachi to Mumbai to strike at 13 locations here.
His confession, which was made before Special Judge M.L. Tahilyani, also included details of his role in the attacks on Chhatrapati Shivaji Terminus (CST).
He also revealed before the stunned courtroom names of his Pakistani handlers, including Abu Hamza, Abu Jindal, Abu Kafa and Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi, who saw them off when they boarded a ship at Karachi.
Hamza advised them how to go about the terror attacks, how he placed one bomb in a taxi (which later exploded at Mazagaon, a south Mumbai area) and how the 10-member team of which he was sole survivor went about their mission.
Naming Lakhvi as 'the mastermind' behind the Mumbai terror mayhem, Kasab described in detail how he and his associate Abu Ismail (who was shot by the police) went to a CST public toilet and assembled one of the bombs by installing a timer in it for use later.
He said that the entire journey from Karachi to Mumbai was completed in four different boats at various locations in the Arabian Sea.
Finally, they landed on the evening of Nov 26 last year and carried out one of the biggest and boldest terror attacks in the country.
[/QUOTE]
The arrested terrorist (names Kasab, a Pkistani national) had initially pleaded not guilty but surprised oen and all (including his lawyer) by all of a sudden confessing on Monday.
http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20090720/812/tnl-kasab-confesses-to-his-role-in-26-11.html
[QUOTE]
Mon, Jul 20 02:53 PM
Mumbai, July 20 (IANS) In a dramatic twist in the ongoing 26/11 Mumbai terror attacks trial, Pakistani terrorist Mohammed Ajmal Amir alias Kasab Monday confessed to his role in carrying out the Mumbai terror attacks which left 180 persons dead and over 300 injured.
'This is a victory of truth and the confession came all of a sudden in the special court,' said special public prosecutor Ujjwal Nikam.
Nikam also said that Kasab made the confession after discussing the issue with his government appointed lawyer S.G. Abbas Kazmi.
Kasab also admitted that he is a Pakistani national and recounted in detail how he and his associates undertook the sea voyage from Karachi to Mumbai to strike at 13 locations here.
His confession, which was made before Special Judge M.L. Tahilyani, also included details of his role in the attacks on Chhatrapati Shivaji Terminus (CST).
He also revealed before the stunned courtroom names of his Pakistani handlers, including Abu Hamza, Abu Jindal, Abu Kafa and Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi, who saw them off when they boarded a ship at Karachi.
Hamza advised them how to go about the terror attacks, how he placed one bomb in a taxi (which later exploded at Mazagaon, a south Mumbai area) and how the 10-member team of which he was sole survivor went about their mission.
Naming Lakhvi as 'the mastermind' behind the Mumbai terror mayhem, Kasab described in detail how he and his associate Abu Ismail (who was shot by the police) went to a CST public toilet and assembled one of the bombs by installing a timer in it for use later.
He said that the entire journey from Karachi to Mumbai was completed in four different boats at various locations in the Arabian Sea.
Finally, they landed on the evening of Nov 26 last year and carried out one of the biggest and boldest terror attacks in the country.
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]
[b]AspiringPhilosophe wrote: [/b]
I beg to differ, Saif.
Islam is not a hateful religion. If it is, then so is Christianity and Judaisim.
The actions that you speak of as being evidence of the hate inside of Islam are the same actions committed by Christians and Jews over the centuries since the development of the religions.
[/QUOTE]
Interesting point, but you should realize that Islam is regarded as the most violent religion "today".
Regarding the warfare between civilizations, the Islamic civilization remains the most conflict prone.
[b]AspiringPhilosophe wrote: [/b]
I beg to differ, Saif.
Islam is not a hateful religion. If it is, then so is Christianity and Judaisim.
The actions that you speak of as being evidence of the hate inside of Islam are the same actions committed by Christians and Jews over the centuries since the development of the religions.
[/QUOTE]
Interesting point, but you should realize that Islam is regarded as the most violent religion "today".
Regarding the warfare between civilizations, the Islamic civilization remains the most conflict prone.
im still waiting for the day when a Buddhist blows himself up in a shopping mall
and whoever said that Islam is the most violent religion in the world today obviously doesnt live in Ulster/Northern Ireland,they kill each other just for wearing an orange sash or playing the flute there..
and whoever said that Islam is the most violent religion in the world today obviously doesnt live in Ulster/Northern Ireland,they kill each other just for wearing an orange sash or playing the flute there..