earthquake in japan

The fear of nuclear meltdown has raised a lot of discussion concerning the safety of nuclear energy in Europe.

Rather unsurprisingly, our newspapers have already contained comments from our authorities stating that OUR nuclear plants are safe and every precaution has been taken and people should not be worried about the safety of nuclear energy. This is like some weird remnant of some form of Orientalist discourse, now suddenly the Japanese are some inferior race that cannot manage their plants, whereas we Europeans would never have such meltdowns. Meltdowns only occur to the Other...

In 2010 Finland's funny parliament granted permission for two companies to build one new nuclear reactor each. But hey, it's safe technology here, unlike in that "technologically backward Japan"... Right?

It's the same here, Pete. 60 000 people demonstrated against a (probably unconstitunional) law that allows longer running times for the German nuclear plants yesterday. Chancellor Merkel promised to have the security "checked", really ridiculous. Not a single nuclear plant in my country has been built without massive public protests and rallies. Now we are told that we cannot "use" the suffering of the Japanes people to re-inflame the fight over nuclear power. I think we MUST use it because I am sure that many Japanes people now wish they had had this dicussion before one reactor after another explodes because the PRIVATE owners did not invest enough into the security of this extremely dangerous technology.

I can understand when people in Canada or Australia have a different view because they live in huge countries and it seems to be a relatively small risk to have nuclear plants somewhere "out there" but in Europe as well as in Japan millions of people live virtually in the front yard of old nuclear plants which have minor "incidents" by the dozens each year. We have  nuclear plants in Germany and France along the Rhine with also the most active earthquake region and the biggest airport in all of Western Europe. Even the fallout of the Chernobyl catastrophe had effects in my country.

I understand that Japan gets a big portion of their energy from nuclear plants but that is only because they did not invest into alternatives in the last decades. There are lots of alternatives but you must have the attitude that energy is a national issue and it cannot be left in the hands of a few profit-oriented companies. In Europe nuclear power has been hugely funded by the tax payer or else it would have never been even profitable. If the companies would have to pay for security and the huge, huge costs of the nuclear waste management nuclear energy would be so expensive that nobody could market it. The only reason to run nuclear reactors in Europe is wanting to have the technology. The overwhelming majority of the people want safe and clean energy and we are willing to fund the technolgy like we did in the last decades. Nobody needs nuclear plants in Germany today - only the companies who make all this profit from a dangerous, tax-funded energy.

I just don't like 'em.  They can make them safe - incredibly safe - but no safety measure can overcome the universal law : SHIT HAPPENS.

Same in Holland. The minister for economic affairs Maxime Verhagen, who also blatantly rigged his party's congress to vote along his lines by making sure opponents didn't have the right voting forms, is currently attempting to push through permits for the construction of *three* nuclear power plants in Borsele, which is *literally* on the sea side (the nuclear power plant already there is less than 50 meters from the sea), in a location that has been severely flooded dozens of times in the past, most recently in 1953. The risk of nuclear contamination in the case of even a small malfunction is disproportionally large.

Meanwhile, at Japan's Fukushima 1 plant, reactor number 3 is causing serious concern. Technicians are pumping in sea-water for emergency cooling, a bad thing already, but it now also appears that said sea-water is not even reaching the reactor itself, which is thus not cooling down. In the meantime, the sea-water used is a) being contaminated with radiation and b) being super-heated to the point where the water molecules break down into hydrogen and oxygen. As happened yesterday, an explosion of *radioactive* hydrogen gas appears likely. So far, over twenty people have been confirmed to have suffered radiation exposure. Estimates currently suggest that the real number is over 100.

Nuclear fission is neither safe nor technologically advanced. A fission plant is quite *literally* nothing more than a uranium-burning steam engine. Anything that comes near enough to the actual reactor gets contaminated - cooling water, the steam used to power the turbines, safety rods, fuel containers, you name it. The possibilities for disaster are endless, and to make a good deal even better, the very unlikely catastrophes are still a serious threat, because even freak conditions occurring once every 500 years fall well within the range of probability, because the nuclear waste created remains highly radioactive for millennia.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/events/japan-quake-2011/beforeafter.htm

See the sixth image from the top for a before-after view of the Fukushima nuclear power plant. The extent of the damage is surreal.

>>>> Sir GH wrote: Wind farms are environmentally friendly, but it's not an option for greater Tokyo with a population of 30 million.  We're just not there yet. <<<<

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And we won't get there any time soon, IMO, because the lobby for them isn't as great - meaning huge, not good - as the oil lobby. In the States, the discussion of cutting oil dependence, finding renewable energy sources and having safer and cleaner power comes up only when there's a catastrophe of some sort. Soon enough, though, the conversation winds down and complacency sets in yet again.

Nuclear energy is one of the biggest crimes mankind has committed so far.
You cannot leave waste behind, that is highly dangerous for thousands of years. Every future society or future generation should have the chance to start from point zero or to correct mistakes that have been done before. It's impossible with nuclear waste.   
I'm convinced that future generations will hate us forever. And all those politicians and engeneers that invented and allowed it will be rated as criminals in the same league as dictators and terrorists. 

It's all so sad......

In our neigbouring country, the readers gave a newspaper hell when they published a cartoon showing ultraman running away from a tsunami.

3 seats left on my rocket to Mars, anyone interested?

It must be horrible for the people to be kept in the dark about the actual extent of the damage after a second reactor building has exploded. There is no way to go - where should millions and millions of people evacuate?

>>>> YourValentine wrote: It must be horrible for the people to be kept in the dark about the actual extent of the damage after a second reactor building has exploded. There is no way to go - where should millions and millions of people evacuate? <<<<

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It's unimaginable. Now they've said yet another reactor's cooling system has failed. And, last I read, radiation has been measured in a 60-mile radius from one of them. They keep calling it 'low levels' as if to imply it's safe.

Why would a country where earthquakes (not 8.9, of course) are so common have nuclear reactors in the first place? If there's need and opportunity for alternative energy innovation, it's in Japan. And by 'alternative', I mean safe and stable as well as clean and renewable.

YourValentine wrote: It must be horrible for the people to be kept in the dark about the actual extent of the damage after a second reactor building has exploded. There is no way to go - where should millions and millions of people evacuate?
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And that's not even taking into account the fact that the reactor that blew up last night, Fukishima 1 - 3, was a plutonium-reactor, meaning the radiation hazard is far higher.

What the Japanese government isn't telling the people - and surprisingly most international media are following them in that sense - is that the release of hydrogen resulting from the explosions in the reactor-buildings also involves radioactive release - the hydrogen gas was formed under high pressure in or near the reactor. Considering the way hydrogen responds to high pressure and radiation, significant amounts of tritium and some quadrium, the two radioactive isotopes of hydrogen, have been released into the atmosphere. Tritium has a half-life of 12.32 years, and sends out bèta radiation. Quadrium will have been released in smaller quantities and has a much shorter half-life (only a fraction of a second), but compensates for that by sending out *neutrons*. So, during the actual explosion, neutrons will have been released, and bèta radiation will remain for years (with this type of radiation being absorbed by plants and animals it is very likely to enter the food supply through fish and food crops). Meanwhile, a US aircraft carrier has detected radiation more than 100 miles from the Japanese shore.

The only realistic news coverage I've been getting so far is from the Belgian media, who don't just repeat what the Japanese government is saying, but now report serious contamination and a nuclear disaster second only to Tchernobyl.

It's frightening, but I think all the catastrophizing is premature.  As far as the wider public goes, this appears much closer to Three Mile Island than Chernobyl at this point, and you have to remember that it's not like we live in a radiation free bubble even without man made nuclear disasters.   That said, I feel immensely for plant workers who are apparently showing signs of radiation related illness.  They must be just sick with fear.  Like military service or front line emergency workers it's a job with inherent risk, but probably nobody really believes it will ever be them.

magicalfreddiemercury wrote:

In the States, the discussion of cutting oil dependence

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They've been talking about it since Nixon.  It's never gonna happen, and you yourself said it... the oil lobby is enormous.

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