musicland munich
f@cking double post...why ???
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Posts in chronological order
Sebastian
[QUOTE]There's no way Mercury would have been well enough to fly on an airplane two weeks before his death.[/QUOTE]
Actually there is.
AFAIK, those diseases aren't necessarily linear in the person's deterioration: some days they'll feel better, some days they'll feel worse, with the 'worse' instances becoming gradually more frequent.
Actually there is.
AFAIK, those diseases aren't necessarily linear in the person's deterioration: some days they'll feel better, some days they'll feel worse, with the 'worse' instances becoming gradually more frequent.
rhyeking
[QUOTE] [b]Sebastian wrote:[/b]
[QUOTE] [b]rhyeking wrote:[/b]The Cross scheduled a promo and live tour for Sept. and Oct.[/QUOTE]
Freddie could go and record his vocals and/or keyboards without Roger being present. It happened a lot anyway.
[QUOTE] [b]rhyeking wrote:[/b]The Summer 1991 Fan Club magazine (released late June/early July) explicitly states that Queen had no further plans to return to the studio that year following their recent session work.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, but plans and decisions change: remember 'Another Miracle'? The anthology? The whole 'no more Queen without Freddie'? The summer 1975 American tour? Opening 'Queen II' with SSOR? Including TMLWKY on 'The Miracle'? Playing in Uruguay in 1983? A second solo album by Freddie? ADatR in DTS 5.1 Surround? Xmas Eve '75 officially released? Rainbow? The intro lyrics on All Dead All Dead? 'Man on Fire' on The Works?
[QUOTE] [b]rhyeking wrote:[/b]Roger Taylor's October letter to the Autumn 1991 Fan Club magazine says Queen recorded 4 tracks earlier in the year.[/QUOTE]
Which doesn't eliminate the possibility of either more tracks being done after that, or new ideas being added (e.g., a new verse) after that.
[QUOTE] [b]rhyeking wrote:[/b]All of this, along with things like Brian working on his solo album, working with Cozy and doing things like Guitar Legends, tells me Queen did nothing together as a band in the studio after May 1991[/QUOTE]
But that doesn't mean Freddie couldn't go to the studio on his own (well, with his entourage) and work on his bits. Queen, even as early as 1974, were long past the 'we all have to be together for every recording session' habit.
[QUOTE] [b]rhyeking wrote:[/b]nor that Freddie recorded anything in the studio after May 1991.[/QUOTE]
Actually, there are quite a few sources claiming the opposite. It wasn't necessarily something usable, it wasn't necessarily something 'new', and it didn't necessarily feature the other Queen members, but there has been some studio activity described.[/QUOTE]
There's no verifiable evidence that Freddie recorded anything after May 1991. We can speculate on dozens of possible alternatives, but all I'm seeing in the argument *for* additional Freddie recordings is a strong desire for it to be true and speculation founded on (at best) circumstantial evidence and A LOT of supposition, as opposed to looking at the concrete evidence we have (what we *know* the band members were doing and when) and drawing a conclusion based on those details.
"Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts." Arthur Conan Doyle (1891)
If definitive evidence arises demonstrating later sessions, between June and November 1991, for Freddie to have recorded any vocal tracks for any song, I'll be thrilled! Show me tracking sheets, tape/file labels, firm records made at the time whose authenticity is confirmed and I'll be the first to happy say I was wrong!
Until then, the evidence tells me Freddie did not record any songs after May 1991.
[QUOTE] [b]rhyeking wrote:[/b]The Cross scheduled a promo and live tour for Sept. and Oct.[/QUOTE]
Freddie could go and record his vocals and/or keyboards without Roger being present. It happened a lot anyway.
[QUOTE] [b]rhyeking wrote:[/b]The Summer 1991 Fan Club magazine (released late June/early July) explicitly states that Queen had no further plans to return to the studio that year following their recent session work.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, but plans and decisions change: remember 'Another Miracle'? The anthology? The whole 'no more Queen without Freddie'? The summer 1975 American tour? Opening 'Queen II' with SSOR? Including TMLWKY on 'The Miracle'? Playing in Uruguay in 1983? A second solo album by Freddie? ADatR in DTS 5.1 Surround? Xmas Eve '75 officially released? Rainbow? The intro lyrics on All Dead All Dead? 'Man on Fire' on The Works?
[QUOTE] [b]rhyeking wrote:[/b]Roger Taylor's October letter to the Autumn 1991 Fan Club magazine says Queen recorded 4 tracks earlier in the year.[/QUOTE]
Which doesn't eliminate the possibility of either more tracks being done after that, or new ideas being added (e.g., a new verse) after that.
[QUOTE] [b]rhyeking wrote:[/b]All of this, along with things like Brian working on his solo album, working with Cozy and doing things like Guitar Legends, tells me Queen did nothing together as a band in the studio after May 1991[/QUOTE]
But that doesn't mean Freddie couldn't go to the studio on his own (well, with his entourage) and work on his bits. Queen, even as early as 1974, were long past the 'we all have to be together for every recording session' habit.
[QUOTE] [b]rhyeking wrote:[/b]nor that Freddie recorded anything in the studio after May 1991.[/QUOTE]
Actually, there are quite a few sources claiming the opposite. It wasn't necessarily something usable, it wasn't necessarily something 'new', and it didn't necessarily feature the other Queen members, but there has been some studio activity described.[/QUOTE]
There's no verifiable evidence that Freddie recorded anything after May 1991. We can speculate on dozens of possible alternatives, but all I'm seeing in the argument *for* additional Freddie recordings is a strong desire for it to be true and speculation founded on (at best) circumstantial evidence and A LOT of supposition, as opposed to looking at the concrete evidence we have (what we *know* the band members were doing and when) and drawing a conclusion based on those details.
"Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts." Arthur Conan Doyle (1891)
If definitive evidence arises demonstrating later sessions, between June and November 1991, for Freddie to have recorded any vocal tracks for any song, I'll be thrilled! Show me tracking sheets, tape/file labels, firm records made at the time whose authenticity is confirmed and I'll be the first to happy say I was wrong!
Until then, the evidence tells me Freddie did not record any songs after May 1991.
Sebastian
Not necessarily vocal tracks - he could've recorded keyboards.
Anyway, there's a lot of evidence implying the four Queennies didn't go to the studios together, but not that they didn't visit the studios separately.
Freddie's confirmed to have been in August (FC info section) and, according to Phoebe (IIRC), Fred only went there to record; David Richards also said (to a QOL discussion about a decade ago IIRC) that Fred recorded shortly before his death.
It's not the same as track-sheets or authenticated signatures but it's still way more than wishful thinking. Freddie could've easily recorded something (even if it was just three seconds of material) in either London or Montreux, between the 23rd of May and the early days of November.
There's in fact nothing concrete to suggest there were post-May sessions, but there's also nothing concrete to suggest there weren't. ML tracksheet says May ... it could've been started in May and finished (Fred-wise) much later, so it doesn't actually prove anything.
So far it's 50/50 in terms of evidence... actually, it's more like 0/0: nothing to prove last sessions were in May, nothing to prove last sessions were after May.
Anyway, there's a lot of evidence implying the four Queennies didn't go to the studios together, but not that they didn't visit the studios separately.
Freddie's confirmed to have been in August (FC info section) and, according to Phoebe (IIRC), Fred only went there to record; David Richards also said (to a QOL discussion about a decade ago IIRC) that Fred recorded shortly before his death.
It's not the same as track-sheets or authenticated signatures but it's still way more than wishful thinking. Freddie could've easily recorded something (even if it was just three seconds of material) in either London or Montreux, between the 23rd of May and the early days of November.
There's in fact nothing concrete to suggest there were post-May sessions, but there's also nothing concrete to suggest there weren't. ML tracksheet says May ... it could've been started in May and finished (Fred-wise) much later, so it doesn't actually prove anything.
So far it's 50/50 in terms of evidence... actually, it's more like 0/0: nothing to prove last sessions were in May, nothing to prove last sessions were after May.
rhyeking
Like I said, if he recorded any song material after May 1991, I'll be thrilled to bits!
Looking at all of the available evidence, including the accounts made as events were unfolding and what we know the band members were doing that year, the conclusion I draw is that Freddie didn't record any song material after May 1991.
And please don't think I'm just being obtuse or rigid on this point. I'm perfectly willing to adjust my conclusions based on new evidence. I weigh everything I read (or see in interviews, etc.) accordingly. Like I said earlier in the thread, putting all the hard dates and information culled from many different sources (reports made at the time and accounts mad since of the band's/Freddie's activities) together for the Chronology book, it seemed clear to me that May was the time of the last recording sessions. Everything I could find on 1991 (and every other year between 1946 and 2012) is in the book, as it relates to their recording and releasing. If there's more, I want to see it.
Looking at all of the available evidence, including the accounts made as events were unfolding and what we know the band members were doing that year, the conclusion I draw is that Freddie didn't record any song material after May 1991.
And please don't think I'm just being obtuse or rigid on this point. I'm perfectly willing to adjust my conclusions based on new evidence. I weigh everything I read (or see in interviews, etc.) accordingly. Like I said earlier in the thread, putting all the hard dates and information culled from many different sources (reports made at the time and accounts mad since of the band's/Freddie's activities) together for the Chronology book, it seemed clear to me that May was the time of the last recording sessions. Everything I could find on 1991 (and every other year between 1946 and 2012) is in the book, as it relates to their recording and releasing. If there's more, I want to see it.
Sebastian
I don't think you're obtuse, stubborn, obstinate, narrow-minded or anything like that. I see where you're coming from and I respect your POV.
For the record, I'm not saying there were recording sessions after May, I'm not saying there weren't... I'm 'agnostic' when it comes to that.
Personally, it makes absolutely no difference to me if Freddie did the last verse of AWT or the middle-eight of ML or the chorus of YDFM in January, May, October, November or whatever. It doesn't make those songs any better than they already are, and I'm not gonna like them any more or any less if I were to find out a more precise date for any of those.
I think, based on what I've read (and it seems you and I share a lot of the same sources for our respective fields of interest), that a lot of the sources are contradictory or revisionist or they're embellishing facts and events, and also a lot of what was said in 1991 might have been to create/force a sense of 'normalcy' amongst the fans.
That's why my conclusion may differ from yours: I think there's nothing strong to believe Freddie's recording career stopped six months before his death (IMO), and there's nothing strong to believe it didn't (IMO).
For the record, I'm not saying there were recording sessions after May, I'm not saying there weren't... I'm 'agnostic' when it comes to that.
Personally, it makes absolutely no difference to me if Freddie did the last verse of AWT or the middle-eight of ML or the chorus of YDFM in January, May, October, November or whatever. It doesn't make those songs any better than they already are, and I'm not gonna like them any more or any less if I were to find out a more precise date for any of those.
I think, based on what I've read (and it seems you and I share a lot of the same sources for our respective fields of interest), that a lot of the sources are contradictory or revisionist or they're embellishing facts and events, and also a lot of what was said in 1991 might have been to create/force a sense of 'normalcy' amongst the fans.
That's why my conclusion may differ from yours: I think there's nothing strong to believe Freddie's recording career stopped six months before his death (IMO), and there's nothing strong to believe it didn't (IMO).