Queen ON Air

The Real Wizard wrote:

Krypto_98 wrote:

I made a short comparison video of the original bootleg of Mannheim vs the Queen on Air version. The bass in Queen on Air sounds more prominent as well as the treble being put up a bit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BDP72-cn54

Ahh, it all depends on which version you're working with !

You say it's the "original bootleg", but this is definitely a later version - maybe even the cassette copy from radio.

The very first bootleg release was Done Under Pressure, in 1986:

http://www.queenlive.ca/queen/86-06-21.htm#pressure1

This and On Air are more or less identical.

I did comment elsewhere that the Mannheim tracks from 'On Air' sound really good, but I should have caveated that by saying that I hadn't compared them to the 'Done Under Pressure' original release and so that was 'standalone' assessment. My old turntable is not really up to a true listen, but I am planning to upgrade very shortly and I do have the original double 'Done Under Pressure' release, so look forward to revisiting that whole gig very soon.

Why do we only get mono when there was supposedly a stereo broadcast of São Paulo on Jovem Pan 2 FM?
Also, if the 6CD version is from the same masters as the 2CD, how can the DJ chatter overlap the fade out?

Gotta admit, what they lack in the Live disc, they make up for it in the sound quality. At least compared to the sources I have now (in the case of Golders Green and Mannheim). The 6 sessions didn't sound bad at all, The sound seemed to open up more compared to the BBC tracks from the 2011 Deluxe Editions. The interviews were okay. An interesting listen, much like the David Wigg interviews.

I hope I'm correct in this, but I think QPL's testing the waters for releasing soundboards of their concerts. I mean other bands have done this, Grateful Dead's a textbook example. I hope these three concerts would be a preview of things to come.

The Kurgan wrote: Why do we only get mono when there was supposedly a stereo broadcast of São Paulo on Jovem Pan 2 FM?
Also, if the 6CD version is from the same masters as the 2CD, how can the DJ chatter overlap the fade out?

All these DJ chats are specially mixed with clean masters for this release.

cmi wrote:

The Kurgan wrote: Why do we only get mono when there was supposedly a stereo broadcast of São Paulo on Jovem Pan 2 FM?
Also, if the 6CD version is from the same masters as the 2CD, how can the DJ chatter overlap the fade out?

All these DJ chats are specially mixed with clean masters for this release.

Ok, thanks.
Bit annoying they decided to overlap the fade outs then.

So, no one is arsed that the Mannheim tracks have been mastered from MP3?

To be honest I'm not surprised, the the 6CD set is a complete disaster as far as I'm concerned.

Negative Creep wrote:

So, no one is arsed that the Mannheim tracks have been mastered from MP3?

It wouldn't be as much of an issue if they came out upfront and said that would be the case, but they do sadly play a bit of a game of 'smoke and mirrors' and half truths.

If they said "we only have Mannheim in MP3 quality but would like to release the best sounding bits of that rather than not at all", then I think that would be viewed far more positively. I think since the box has come out, Greg Brooks has answered a complainant that was unhappy with only parts of the gigs being included, by stating that these are the only bits that QPL have to be workable and so its better than nothing. This is the sort of info that should be openly put out there upfront really and it really would save them a lot of flack.

A real issue the band and their 'people' have is poorly managing their customers' expectations up front.

I always thought that the Deep Cuts version of MoTBQ was played as an BBC session. Or am I wrong? Was MoTBQ only re-mixed for the Deep Cuts album then?



Tom

Negative Creep wrote:

So, no one is arsed that the Mannheim tracks have been mastered from MP3?

Can't say as though I care.
I'm perfectly happy with the bootleg version which is far more complete than what QPL have offered us.

Apart from the BBC Sessions themselves, the rest of the release is just a load of butchered highlights from concerts and radio interviews.

TomP63 wrote:

I always thought that the Deep Cuts version of MoTBQ was played as an BBC session. Or am I wrong? Was MoTBQ only re-mixed for the Deep Cuts album then?



Tom

The latter you said.

Thank you Claudio!


Tom

We also have to clarify some things here. There are two following questions which should be answered:

1) With Queen On Air, was the purpose of this release presenting to us what was heard and in what quality on the day of the original broadcast?

2) Did Queen Archivist or someone from the Queen Productions went to local radio archives (BBC, Argentinian and German Radio) and looked for the best possible sources ? Or if the answer to the question 1) is "yes", Queen Productions has in their archives a better sources but presented us the quality in which the material on the release was presented on the original day of the broadcast ?

MercurialFreddie wrote:

We also have to clarify some things here. There are two following questions which should be answered:

1) With Queen On Air, was the purpose of this release presenting to us what was heard and in what quality on the day of the original broadcast?

2) Did Queen Archivist or someone from the Queen Productions went to local radio archives (BBC, Argentinian and German Radio) and looked for the best possible sources ? Or if the answer to the question 1) is "yes", Queen Productions has in their archives a better sources but presented us the quality in which the material on the release was presented on the original day of the broadcast ?

----------

I think that depends on the publishing rights and ownership. Probably queen has access to the orginal mastertapes and made a perfect scan of it with the best modern technology. The OLd copy of the master from the bbc tapes isn't used I think. QP has to work with the BBC as there are clear logo 's of them on all the packaging formats, and pay a decent amount of money or a percentage of the earnings. Depends on the deal they made.

The Real Wizard wrote:

So here's my overall two cents:

I'm happy with this release, but not ecstatic. There's a lot that they got right, and a lot that they could've done so much better.

Let's start with the good:

The BBC sessions are now out in their entirety, full stop. Every note, exactly as it was played. No overdubbing, no fixes (except for two very small adjustments in sessions 1 and 2 as mentioned earlier in this thread), and no loudness war. The BBC tracks on the 2011 remasters were partly brickwalled, but in 2016 they breathe as they should. There is little new here for those of us who have keenly collected every morsel of unreleased Queen music they can find (the intro to Ogre Battle is now happily reunited with the rest of the track in excellent quality, and sessions 2 and 4 particularly sound much better that what we'd heard), but for the wider audience this is a significant chapter in the Queen story out there for the taking now. Well done, QP.

The 6 disc version has DJ commentary (sometimes abridged) after most of the tracks, which is a delightful addition if we're looking for a period piece here. And for those who don't dig the idea, the 2 disc and LP versions have just the music. Everybody wins.

Many of the interviews are unheard, and are well worth a gander. But a couple of the ones that have circulated for years present some issues. They used the standard copy for the Kenny Everett one and did some god-awful hiss reduction on it. What kind of professional was actually satisfied with these results? All I hear in the musical segments is digital artifacts, and an overall digital swirl in the tape hiss. It was better as it was.

And they significantly cut the 1977 interview by over 20 minutes, despite having released the whole thing with their 40th anniversary book (well, they released only half of it at first, but that's a whole other story). The 1989 interview is missing over ten minutes as well. It only makes one wonder how much of the unheard material is abridged.

The Golders Green Hippodrome 73 radio broadcast has been available in complete form for over a decade (and bootlegged in part since the 70s), and the official release does not provide an increase in sound quality (although the spoken introduction by Alan Black is slightly longer). See What A Fool I've Been is cut due to sound quality (fair enough), but Jailhouse Rock is under a minute long before it fades out, making one wonder why it was even included at all. And then we have incomplete versions of Sao Paulo 81 and Mannheim 86. The latter is forgettable, as a recording of equal quality has been out on bootleg since 1986. The live disc is under 74 minutes long, so even with their butchering philosophy there was room for one or two more Sao Paulo tracks. But for the entire Sao Paulo show not to be included is a travesty, as it is better sound quality than any previous FM or bootleg copy we've heard.

However, this does highlight a spot of encouragement - they are now willing to release uncut mono recordings when they were previously all about multi-tracks. It remains bizarre that QP has not jumped onto the digital medium of selling unheard concerts for download. If money is what they're after, then they should dip into Brian's catalogue of mono and stereo soundboard tapes and release them for £10 apiece. Thousands of people would buy every single one that upgraded what was on the bootleg market. The "top 100 bootlegs" project was rancid, where they sold audience recordings that ran at the wrong speed and inferior copies of shows they officially released. A version 2.0, where they actually listened to experts who know what the fanbase wants, could usher in an era of not only dialogue but utmost satisfaction for all parties. And in the digital realm this is remarkably easy to achieve. The failures of the On Air release would be instantly forgiven. The effort would be minimal - bake the tapes, transfer them to digital, and put them up for download. They will sell.

Until then - On Air is a reminder that QP have the capacity to get it right, but often fall short of the mark.

Had they left it as a 2 disc release, it would be a 10/10.

But choosing to do an expanded version with so many flaws and omissions drops it to a 7/10.

Now bring on the 76-79 live stuff !

Great review Bob, thanks! As a side comment, I really liked the "A version 2.0, where they actually listened to experts who know what the fanbase wants," Hint, hint ;)

Cheers,

Ogre-