Roger's drumming at 46664

"I know the exact moment your referring to during the FIRST & ONLY performance of Innuendo. He did have a minor mis-cue."

Okay, I'll take back my comment about Innuendo at the FM Tribute. But that does not excuse Roger's performance at 46664.

"I hate to say it, but that one little piece of nit-picking just discredited your entire post as far as I'm concerned."

So a single comment negates the other 6 or 7 comments? That's Queenzone logic for you.

"check out a few of the song books Queen have published over the years, you might be a little surprised at some of the time signitures."

I was talking only about the songs performed at 46664. I'm well aware that some Queen songs do indeed have obscure time sigs. :)

"By the way Guitar hero, how many albums have you played on? sold out many stadiums recently?"

So in other words, you're not allowed to listen deeply and critique music unless you're an international sensation? God, how many times on this board in a week can I find people who attack the person, and not the problem? It's getting really tedious. Stop making stupid comments like this, and realize that Queen weren't perfect at all times. It's okay to critique; that's what the message board is here for!

"You dont have to have sold out any stadiums to realize Rogers drumming was crappy. Just look at his performance with the corrs. You see him thinking: " When is the break.....dammit gotta focus...1.2...3...4....he, that corr-drummer is good looking..2..3..4...hell missed the break...well i'll get the next one right...oh shit..missed it again....well two breaks so close to each other is asking for problems....2...3....4.! gotta look cool...gotta look cool...2...3...4.""

lol! Right on... :)

"Let's stop talking crap about Roger, and talk about him as one of the best drummers in the game for 1/4 century
and a writer of great, timeless music"

I'm not denying any of this. :) Post a new topic and talk about that, if you'd like. But in this topic, we're talking about how his drumming sucked ass at 46664.

"Rog has never played outside of 3/4 or 4/4 time in his life"

Look, as far as I can see from this statement you are not talking about just the 46664 concert, you say "in his life" please write what you mean rather than trying to defend stupid statements like that, as we all know there are plenty of Queen songs not in these time sigs.

The problem I have with your post is not that it is attacking Roger, it is that you are factually incorrect.

Music is not about preforming a song without any variation, it is about creating a mood and if you do that by playing faster or slower in a live situation or with or without cymbal chokes then so be it, just because he didn't play it the same way as on the album does not mean it was crap, just different.


And as I said until you have been in a stage situation like the ones of that size, you have absolutly no idea how difficult it is to hear what everyone is doing, it's not like the record, it's live and you have to play with other people whos timings may vary and will play it differently to the way you expect, so it becomes more fluid.

I really believe if you knew how hard it was you would cut people more slack.

"I really believe if you knew how hard it was you would cut people more slack."

Hard or not hard - it doesn't matter. Roger is supposed to be professional and to be used to all the difficulties that a live event has. He simply doesn't fulfil his own high standards anymore. He only gets to play such huge events because of past glory, not because of his present-day abilities. And that's a shame. Younger people who play like he does today wouldn't have any chance in the business.

Sorry Hank but I just don't buy that, professional or not doesn't make any difference if there are technical difficulties in hearing people, but basically I just don't understand what the fuss is about, having watched it several times from TV to internet I just don't think he played badly.

There was nothing wrong with his playing on either the Corrs song or any other, and the comments about why does he need to have two drummers are plain stupid, it was not done for support it was done for effect, it was a live show and it was fun to have two drummers on some songs whether it called for it or not.

I just find it ammusing to see folk on this site be so critical of something, when there was nothing wrong, I can only think it's because they feel it makes them look good.

Basically I'm sure in his younger days he was faster and fitter, but he did nothing wrong on the night and played well.

Now everyones intitled to their opinion, but the majority of facts in this post have been incorrect, just look back and see how many holes have been picked in Guitar heros argument.

Just being a member of Queen does not mean he is blameless and can walk on water, but in this case he doesn't deserve the bad rap he is getting.

And as the concert is now available on the 46664 web site lets all have a look and see, show me the exact spot you say he was not in time, there is a time counter in the bottom left hand corner of Windows media so tell me the point, and we can all go a check it out, it only takes two minuets to check.

"Look, as far as I can see from this statement you are not talking about just the 46664 concert, you say "in his life" please write what you mean rather than trying to defend stupid statements like that, as we all know there are plenty of Queen songs not in these time sigs."

Okay, I completely apologize for making that comment. I am a musician who (usually) knows what he's talking about, and I don't know what the hell I was thinking with this one.

"Music is not about preforming a song without any variation, it is about creating a mood and if you do that by playing faster or slower in a live situation or with or without cymbal chokes then so be it, just because he didn't play it the same way as on the album does not mean it was crap, just different."

Yes, very true, but when a song is missing key elements, it will certainly not sound good, compared to the record or not. Honestly, how would Toss The Feathers have sounded had the Corrs drummer not been there?

"until you have been in a stage situation like the ones of that size, you have absolutly no idea how difficult it is to hear what everyone is doing"

Absolutely not. As Hank said, if you're a professional, then you should perform like one. I've never once heard Mike Portnoy from Dream Theater screw up on the drums, and he plays concerts for hours in dozens of time signatures.

"He simply doesn't fulfil his own high standards anymore. He only gets to play such huge events because of past glory, not because of his present-day abilities."

Right on.

"Younger people who play like he does today wouldn't have any chance in the business."

Unfortunately, the same doesn't go for guitarists. 95% of the guitarists in rock bands (commercial or not) couldn't do what Brian May is doing now, never mind in 1975.

"I just find it ammusing to see folk on this site be so critical of something, when there was nothing wrong, I can only think it's because they feel it makes them look good."

There was nothing wrong, in your opinion. We're not here for a ego-boost, like you're suggesting. We're here for a discussion.

"just look back and see how many holes have been picked in Guitar heros argument."

Where are the other holes?

"And as the concert is now available on the 46664 web site lets all have a look and see"

I really wish I could take you up on your idea, but I couldn't possibly be able to do that with a dial-up connection. :( The best I could do is watch my VCR tape, and set the clock back to 0:00 when TtF starts.

"I've never once heard Mike Portnoy from Dream Theater screw up on the drums, and he plays concerts for hours in dozens of time signatures,"

I want to see him when he's 55 and plays 4 concerts a year

Neil Peart from Rush is 51 now, and he's showing no signs of decline. Peart now is leagues ahead of Taylor at any point.

Also, Mike Portnoy in his prime and Roger Taylor in his prime aren't even comparable. Portnoy is doing things on the drums that Roger would have no clue of at any point in his life. 15/8, 7/8, double-kick, and 3 hour shows. They're not even in the same league. Rog was a great drummer in his prime, but nowhere near guys like Bonham, Portnoy and Peart.

But really, it's like comparing apples and oranges. Rog played in a pop-oriented band (although I'm well aware they steered far away from pop at times). Rush and Dream Theater are not pop-oriented bands. They are progressive rock bands, and they create music that could never be caught dead on the radio, simply because it's far beyond the mindset of the average listener.

Not to condemn people who aren't musicians, but non-musicians just cannot understand that previous sentence. Dream Theater in particular are so musically brilliant that the average person just cannot tell the difference between them and the fast guitar soloing of someone like Billy Corgan. I already talked about this once in a topic, but nobody replied. Too bad, as it could have been a damn good discussion.

"I want to see him when he's 55 and plays 4 concerts a year"

Portnoy won't be stupid enough to play this little, and get out of shape and practice. Peart too. Both practice like crazy.

I haven't seen the TTF video yet but from the mp3 it sounds like there's a Bodhran player in there as well as two drummers.

bitch, moan, gripe

Is there the faintest possibility that people could watch a performance by Brian and Roger and NOT feel the need to come online and slag them off? Not being the least bit musical I have no idea what you're referring to (although I CAN tell if a beat is out of time), especially as I haven't watched the thing yet.

However, I wouldn't expect Roger Taylor to sit at my keyboard and whack out 14,500 keystrokes per hour at 98% accuracy like me so I don't think I have the right to start slagging him off for doing what he does, when I wouldn't know where to start with a drumkit.

I'd prefer to bitch and moan that the TV coverage of a concert to highlight what is after all a global problem was beyond poor; the heavily edited 70-minute version shown on Channel 4 had commercials after the first number - all of five minutes. And although I did stream it off the internet I couldn't actually sit and watch it because the image was just too small.

You know what, you guys? If you heard my drumming, even I at my young age could be barely comparable to Roger Taylor in some areas. I'm certainy no better than he is, or maybe was even when he was younger.
I play basic beats most of the time, and I can hardly even play the hard rock section of BohRap on the drums myself.

Don't go slagging Roger because of his age - even in my music class, there is one drummer (out of 4 including myself) who is around my age and is terrible, just horrible at drums.
Not EVERY one is perfect, and don't bother slagging Roger off either.

(And NO I am not saying I am a better drummer than Roger)

Dark, you're certainly right about being able to replicate Roger's beats. But Roger does play with a certain precision that's tough to come by. In over 200 live performances with Queen from 73-86, I've never once heard him going off beat.

"Is there the faintest possibility that people could watch a performance by Brian and Roger and NOT feel the need to come online and slag them off?"

But that's what musicians do. They praise as well as critique other musicians, especially the latter, when it's due.

"I'd prefer to bitch and moan that the TV coverage of a concert to highlight what is after all a global problem was beyond poor; the heavily edited 70-minute version shown on Channel 4 had commercials after the first number - all of five minutes. And although I did stream it off the internet I couldn't actually sit and watch it because the image was just too small."

Good, your bitching and moaning is welcome. But don't slag off people for dicussing a matter that is over your head, even as you pointed out yourself. We can discuss what we'd like, the same way you can discuss what you'd like. I'm not going to complain in a topic in the personal section about British politics for example, just because I'm not well-educated on the matter.

I am a musician and noticed no mistakes by Roger. With age he has definately slowed down, or seems to have, maybe he just doesn't want to sweat on stage any more.

Some people like to critique a musician's performance. It doesn't mean that person hates the musician or won't ever listen to the musician again, but that person is merely observing what he or she has seen and is sharing it with others to discuss.

However, when that person is attacked for saying what he or she observed, it's unjustified. I'll agree that Roger is indeed showing his age - and I don't care what anyone says about what I have to say - but it doesn't make the music any less listenable (which is what Guitar Hero is trying to convey).

I haven't been privileged enough to witness the recent performances of Queen, but seeing as Roger's last solo tour was sometine in 1999, and, from what I understand, he didn't play drums all that much, I can only imagine what kind of shape he is in. He himself admitted to not practicing regularly, and I can only gather that he's not interested in playing drums much anymore. If he had any reason to practice - be it a solo tour or something with Queen - then I'm sure he'd be far better than he is, but he just seems very disinterested in being a drummer anymore.

But that's not saying he's a horrible drummer - he WAS a good drummer when he was with Queen and as a solo artist - but, because his last major tour that he was a full-fledged drummer was seventeen years ago, the plain and simple truth is that he's not what he used to be.

And you can say "how can you go around criticizing Roger for what he does? He doesn't come to where you work and criticize how you do it!", but I'm a drummer, so I'll notice when a drummer is good or bad. Roger's not bad, but he certainly isn't good. And also, anyone can wait tables, so I'm not exactly saying I'm great at my job either :)

There's the best post in the topic, right there.

I'm sorry, GH, I didn't realise that by not being a musician I wasn't allowed to post in this thread. And a pat on the back to Lester for a constructive argument.