Selling Queen demos ?

In the same way that Fuller invites instinctive distaste by openly rejecting some group norms and pursuing an independent course that can be seen as disloyal or a betrayal, so too do people whose actions are at one level those of a snivelly, sulky, self righteous rat. The reality is that many don't really think much of rats either.

Needless to say, no apology will be forthcoming. But do have a Happy Easter inu, a first one I think with your new daughter. Enjoy the day.

Please explain how reporting violations of copyright law to the appropriate copyright holders and protecting people from getting ripped off by unscrupulous individuals makes me a "rat"

I think you're quite fucked in the head, you judgmental little bitch. Making unrealistic comparisons like that...GO FUCK YOURSELF.

Maybe you should move to Alberta. You'd fit in just fine with all the other ignorant assholes I have to deal with here on a daily basis. Yup, all the nice little assholes that keep contributing to the depression which I don't speak about that in turn causes me to have suicidal thoughts, who nobody seems to care if I have them or not.

Oh and a happy easter to you too.

Let me be very blunt and very plain. [b][i]
The difference between morality and legality.[/i][/b]

Forget all the sweet and twee talk, financial Capitalistic elitism and trickle down models. Let me talk about something we all understand - sex. For my allegory; I will discuss three types of sex.

Single people's sex: No commitments, no ties all Footloose and fancy free; The morality of which is down to the belief of the individual. If one leans towards atheism or free love - there are no moral issues. On the other hand if one is a devout Catholic or Latter day Saint, then there are very strong moral objections, but the point is, [b][i]this sexual liaison is not ILLEGAL,[/i][/b] (No matter how loudly your momma complains).

Adultery: very morally suspect, but again not illegal. One cannot go to prison for adultery, no matter how many families it wrecks. Actually this kind of sex can be seen as both prostitution and incestuous as far as my Queen allegory is concerned, because most Queen fans end up in bed together (metaphorically speaking) as a mutual agreement because both parties will end satisfying each other. Of course this can be seen as suspect,[b][i] but it is consensual and not criminal.[/i][/b]

Rape: [b][i]What David Fuller has done is illegal. His behaviour is illegal,[/i][/b] and he can go to prison because he is blatantly and loudly screwing the band out of all royalties and legalities without and permission or consent whatsoever.

Forget the twee politically correct answers. There are none.[i][b] This is a short message to differentiate between morality and illegality[/b][/i]. One is not against the law, and is not a punishable by offence. The other is illegal and ends up as a court case, and may end up in penal servitude.

That is the law, and the law is the law. Some of us may be a musical sluts, and I accept the feigned outraged of the morally outraged; but please, please, please never call me a criminal, not only is there a world of difference, but it is actually a criminal offence for you to do so!

[QUOTE]

[b]inu-liger wrote: [/b] Please explain how reporting violations of copyright law to the appropriate copyright holders and protecting people from getting ripped off by unscrupulous individuals makes me a "rat"

I think you're quite fucked in the head, you judgmental little bitch. Making unrealistic comparisons like that...GO FUCK YOURSELF.

Maybe you should move to Alberta. You'd fit in just fine with all the other ignorant assholes I have to deal with here on a daily basis. Yup, all the nice little assholes that keep contributing to the depression which I don't speak about that in turn causes me to have suicidal thoughts, who nobody seems to care if I have them or not.

Oh and a happy easter to you too.[/QUOTE]   

  just in case you try to delete this ...

Vindictive much, Holly2003?

[QUOTE]

[b]John S Stuart wrote: [/b] Let me be very blunt and very plain. The difference between morality and legality.

Forget all the sweet and twee talk, financial Capitalistic elitism and trickle down models. Let me talk about something we all understand - sex. For my allegory; I will discuss three types of sex.

Single people's sex: No commitments, no ties all Footloose and fancy free; The morality of which is down to the belief of the individual. If one leans towards atheism or free love - there are no moral issues. On the other hand if one is a devout Catholic or Latter day Saint, then there are very strong moral objections, but the point is, this sexual liaison is not ILLEGAL, (No matter how loudly your momma complains).

Adultery: very morally suspect, but again not illegal. One cannot go to prison for adultery, no matter how many families it wrecks. Actually this kind of sex can be seen as both prostitution and incestuous as far as my Queen allegory is concerned, because most Queen fans end up in bed together (metaphorically speaking) as a mutual agreement because both parties will end satisfying each other. Of course this can be seen as suspect, but it is consensual and not criminal.

Rape: What David Fuller has done is illegal. His behaviour is illegal, and he can go to prison because he is blatantly and loudly screwing the band out of all royalties and legalities without and permission or consent whatsoever.

Forget the twee politically correct answers. There are none. This is a short message to differentiate between morality and illegality. One is not against the law, and is not a punishable by offence. The other is illegal and ends up as a court case, and may end up in penal servitude.

That is the law, and the law is the law. Some of us may be a musical sluts, and I accept the feigned outraged of the morally outraged; but please, please, please never call me a criminal, not only is there a world of difference, but it is actually a criminal offence for you to do so!
[/QUOTE]

Like The Real Wizard, you too would be best avoiding daft analogies. Selling demos is like rape ... okaaaaaay...

But you are right about one thing: if he is selling copyrighted material Fuller is on very dubious ground here, more so because his former chums now have it in for him. To quote Spinal Tap's manager, "Money talks and bullshit walks" ... errr. whatever that means. If QP and Universal believe they will lose money because of shares/selling like this they will go after him. It's possible he might end up facing criminal charges and a fine. Of course, if he decides to rat out where he got all these files from, some others might have to answer a few questions too. However, if all the material you guys own was obtained legally or you haven't financially profited from selling copyrighted items then I would guess you have nothing much to worry about.

Mind you, everyone is assuming that Fuller web link is genuine. It wouldn't take very much effort to fake a web page.

[QUOTE]

[b]inu-liger wrote: [/b] Vindictive much, Holly2003?[/QUOTE]

You said it, not me.

Double post: NOT A DELETION

No Holly: do not twist my words.

My simple point is that [b][i]selling Demos like Rape (or murder, or theft) is illegal.[/i][/b]
Is that so really difficult to grasp?
Morality Vs Legality is not a grey area. One is illegal. The other is not.
But I guess you missed the bits that said allegory and metaphorical.

[QUOTE]

[b]John S Stuart wrote: [/b] No Holly: do not twist my words.

My simple point is that selling Demos like Rape (or murder, or theft) is illegal. Is that so really difficult to grasp?
Morality Vs Legality is not a grey area. One is illegal. The other is not.
But I guess you missed the bits that said allegory and metaphorical.

[/QUOTE] I didn't twist your words: you made an analogy. A daft one. Why not compare it to genocide? The Holocaust perhaps? Is there nothing this man Fuller wont do!!!! Won't someone please think of the children!!!!

PS; staying with the sexual "METAPHOR"; I have done nothing "illegal".

If I go to a car boot sale and buy a batch of second hand video tapes - or even home made DVD's. They are now MY property. I bought them legally. No argument. Legally or morally. Cut and dried.

However; if one of those tapes or discs turn out to be a home made porn-tape, would I own the contents - no - but I will still own the MATERIAL tape or disc as an ARTIFACT. That at all times remains MY property.

What I do with my property (the disc) is my business, but the content is NOT mine; so I cannot freely distribute.

If I decide to show that discs to the others in my home, I am free to do so.

But as soon as I (or anyone else brodcasts the content of that material on the internet) - it is THEY who pay the price for broadcast.

Example:

Police at Door: Mr Stuart?
Me: Yes.
Police: I have reason to believe you legally bought a tape of Holly performing sexal acts?
Me: That is correct officer. Here is the very tape here.
Police: You are the legal owner?
Me: Oh yes sir, I am.
Police: Did you share a copy with David R Fuller?
Me; Yes Officer I did so. We did so because we are both sexual perverts, and he promised to pay me with another disc in return.
Police: And did he keep his side of the bargain?
Me: No sir.
Police: Do you know he broadcast and sold the tape on the internet?
Me: No Sir:
Police: Did you Know Holly is very upset?
Me: I would imagine they would be; but I can assure you that I did not obtain the material illegally and I had no intention of public disemination.
I shared with Mr Fuller because I thought he would keep up his side of the bargain.
Police: Did he have your permission to share?
Me: No sir.
Police: Did he have Holly's Permission to share?
Me; No Sir.
Police: So Mr. Fuller is fully aware and responsible for his own actions?
Me: Yes sir.
Police: So you accept repsponsibilty for the distribution of this material?
Me: No Sir.
Me. I accept full responsibility for passing a single copy to Mr. Fuller for his own personal and private use; after that, it really is up to him to accept responsibility for his own actions.


Now; imagine a similar conversation, except I bought a legitimate tape or acetate from an auction house?
You still cannot see how one is illegal and the other is not?

(PS The words Metaphor and allegory still stand valid).

Repeat post... NOT A DELETION

Repeat post... NOT A DELETION

Well its nice for you that you can fantasise about having sexual acts with me John. I'm very err.. flattered. I suppose. 

As for the legal/illegal thing, pull your troosers up and read what I said earlier.

Holly - let's play fair.

I do respect you - that's why I did not share the contents of the tape;-)

You wrote: Why not compare it to genocide? The Holocaust perhaps?

I reply: Ok I will; they are all the same in that they are [b][i]ALL[/i][/b] illegal.
(It is futile to argue otherwise!)

I accept some crimes are far more serious than others; thus six months inside for for persistant vandalism - and twenty-five years to life for muder.

But although these offences seem poles apart - do you know what the vandal and the murderer have in common?

[b][i]They are both criminals with criminal records[/i][/b], and David Fuller; has committed criminal acts, and will be called to face the consequences. That is the law.

As I said; be fair. There is no way in this world you can mention he and I in the same sentence, because my acts have not at any stage been illegal..

His acts however, have been illegal throughout.

One of my sins may be pride; but please do not place us in the same category when you know deep down we are not the same at all.