When I still was a little Dennis :-P, I started collecting Queen DVD boots. I didn't know how bootlegs from other artists looked like, so I was pretty satisfied with the stuff I got.
A lot DVD's contained horribly high generation tapes, putted on a disc. People didn't care wether it was in sync, VCD-sourced, Kazaa quality and most of the times without a decent menu.
Ínformation was hard to find, and a good front-cover even harder.
Now I've got into The Who and Pink Floyd boots, and I'm amazed how mutch effort people take to make a nice DVD. Pink Floyd even has "bootleg producers" who collect nice footage, always as low generation as possible. Make proffesional moving menu's ect. I take harvested for example.
The footage might be shot from far and with one camera, they always make it look the best way they can. Most of the times you can choose what kind of audio you want, like 5.1 dolby digital.
There are sites wich contains several covers and technical information about the circulating version.
Another example from The Who (Houston '75). Fans took the effort in collecting 2 audience sources straight from the master, and compile a highly interesting video. It's as enjoyable to watch as a proffesional recording, with Excellent audio. It contains a great menu and they putted on a lot of bonus video's. They always put on bonus video's.
These are just a view examples from artists. Why can't we Queen fans do this? Give the best experience on all of our boots? Why do we keep low generation tapes to ourselves?
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I always had the same thoughts. Some time ago a group of Genesis fans bought a very rare roll of film (!) of a band's Shepperton 1973 performance (only about 5 of them were printed). They spend a LOT money for the film itself. Then they restored the video and sound and transferred it to DVD (Tranfering flim to video is very complex operation by the way). Result is really amazing. And after spending months of work and thousands of bucks they shared it on Dime for free! But at the same time some people on queenzone were preaching about Houston video been shared. Kind of shame...
I actually agree with you. Although there are quite a few excellent bootlegs, the audience shot ones are relatively poor compared to other bands. Of course it's not fair to compare the Freddie period with bands that are around today, since equipment was not at the same level as today's. But when compared to other classic bands, the lay-out / editing of bootlegs is rather poor.
But then again, you didn't do anything yourself to improve that. So, it looks like you are just as lazy as other Queenfans (including myself). Maybe Queen fans are not as passionate about bootlegging as other band's fans. Most of them are actually to lazy to figure out how to get torrents working.
Look at any other band's fan-page, and everybody uses torrents without a problem.
But then again, you didn't do anything yourself to improve that. So, it looks like you are just as lazy as other Queenfans (including myself). Maybe Queen fans are not as passionate about bootlegging as other band's fans. Most of them are actually to lazy to figure out how to get torrents working.
Look at any other band's fan-page, and everybody uses torrents without a problem.
[QUOTE][QUOTENAME]<font color=black>Dennis Daja<h6>QZs God wrote: [/QUOTENAME]
Now I've got into The Who and Pink Floyd boots, and I'm amazed how mutch effort people take to make a nice DVD. Pink Floyd even has "bootleg producers" who collect nice footage, always as low generation as possible. Make proffesional moving menu's ect. I take harvested for example.
The footage might be shot from far and with one camera, they always make it look the best way they can. Most of the times you can choose what kind of audio you want, like 5.1 dolby digital.
There are sites wich contains several covers and technical information about the circulating version.
Another example from The Who (Houston '75). Fans took the effort in collecting 2 audience sources straight from the master, and compile a highly interesting video. It's as enjoyable to watch as a proffesional recording, with Excellent audio. It contains a great menu and they putted on a lot of bonus video's. They always put on bonus video's.
These are just a view examples from artists. Why can't we Queen fans do this? Give the best experience on all of our boots? Why do we keep low generation tapes to ourselves?
[/QUOTE]
That's a very true statement. I've been collecting Led Zeppelin for a while now and I'm always amazed how the LZ trading community actually cares about the quality and the integrity of the music they spread. There are virtually no mp3 sources and they have managed to track down and transfered the masters or low gens (i.e. 1st gen, 2nd gen, 3rd gen) of about 90% of the shows available. There are hardly any shows without lineage and there are A LOT of master transfers. Plus you have to consider that LZ played their first show in 1968 and most of their shows available are from the first half of the 70ies, so for obvious reasons it's been a lot more difficult to track down these sources than it would be for Queen shows. For example many of the '69 LZ shows available are from the masters while of Queen's Magic Tour there is not a single (!!) verified master transfer and hardly low gen ones. This situation is just sad and the fact that very few people in the Queen trading scene actually care about lineages prevents the fans and collectors from hearing the recorded shows in the best quality and most complete form possible. Instead of only looking for 'new' shows traders should track down low gens of the shows that are available already. I know that sounds a lot easier than it actually is, but if it can be done for other artists, why shouldn't it be possible for Queen as well?
Now I've got into The Who and Pink Floyd boots, and I'm amazed how mutch effort people take to make a nice DVD. Pink Floyd even has "bootleg producers" who collect nice footage, always as low generation as possible. Make proffesional moving menu's ect. I take harvested for example.
The footage might be shot from far and with one camera, they always make it look the best way they can. Most of the times you can choose what kind of audio you want, like 5.1 dolby digital.
There are sites wich contains several covers and technical information about the circulating version.
Another example from The Who (Houston '75). Fans took the effort in collecting 2 audience sources straight from the master, and compile a highly interesting video. It's as enjoyable to watch as a proffesional recording, with Excellent audio. It contains a great menu and they putted on a lot of bonus video's. They always put on bonus video's.
These are just a view examples from artists. Why can't we Queen fans do this? Give the best experience on all of our boots? Why do we keep low generation tapes to ourselves?
[/QUOTE]
That's a very true statement. I've been collecting Led Zeppelin for a while now and I'm always amazed how the LZ trading community actually cares about the quality and the integrity of the music they spread. There are virtually no mp3 sources and they have managed to track down and transfered the masters or low gens (i.e. 1st gen, 2nd gen, 3rd gen) of about 90% of the shows available. There are hardly any shows without lineage and there are A LOT of master transfers. Plus you have to consider that LZ played their first show in 1968 and most of their shows available are from the first half of the 70ies, so for obvious reasons it's been a lot more difficult to track down these sources than it would be for Queen shows. For example many of the '69 LZ shows available are from the masters while of Queen's Magic Tour there is not a single (!!) verified master transfer and hardly low gen ones. This situation is just sad and the fact that very few people in the Queen trading scene actually care about lineages prevents the fans and collectors from hearing the recorded shows in the best quality and most complete form possible. Instead of only looking for 'new' shows traders should track down low gens of the shows that are available already. I know that sounds a lot easier than it actually is, but if it can be done for other artists, why shouldn't it be possible for Queen as well?
Hah. I've long known it was a shitty situation, but you guys have made it even clearer with this thread. This is a good discussion.
I wouldn't do it because I really don't care that there is a better quality version of the concert that I have on audio/dvd/vhs somewhere in this planet. I really can't be arsed to see Freddie in slightly better quality. And I certainly don't care about seeing dvd's which have 4 20 second pieces of songs in a very distant shot with godaweful grainy and blurry quality
[QUOTE][QUOTENAME]FriedChicken<br><font size=1>The Almighty</font> wrote: [/QUOTENAME]And I certainly don't care about seeing dvd's which have 4 20 second pieces of songs in a very distant shot with godaweful grainy and blurry quality[/QUOTE]
But if the best possible version was made available, it wouldn't be grainy and blurry at all, right? But the problem is, people are selfish and want to keep everything for themselves, as if they have legal rights to it or something.
Niek, you've got a pretty low view on bootlegs, because you're used to Queen bootlegs... most of which, on the grand scale of things, are crap. As has already been mentioned, there are so many amazing Zeppelin/Floyd/Who bootlegs out there, and they are completely the work of devoted fans. We have little of that in the Queen community.
I know of so many people who have audience and soundboard recordings of Queen, and for various reasons, they want to keep them to themselves. Here's a list of what I know exists:
London 3-31-74 complete soundboard, clone of master (only complete UK Queen II recording)
Cleveland 1-23-77 soundboard master
Syracuse 2-8-77 audience recording, complete (only complete US ADATR recording)
Atlanta 2-21-77 video
Liverpool 77 complete soundboard (not sure which night)
Los Angeles 12-22-77 audience recording, second generation
Monterrey 10-9-81 video
Puebla 81 video (not sure which night)
Drammen 4-10-82 audience recording
Leiden 9-20-84 soundboard
Auckland 4-13-85 (not sure if it's audience or soundboard)
Leiden 86 soundboard (not sure which night)
These things are all kept under wraps, and many can give us great insight into Queen as a live band. The only recordings of Queen doing White Christmas, Freddie drunk on stage, and concerts in Mexico are all secrets to most of us.
Good topic.
But if the best possible version was made available, it wouldn't be grainy and blurry at all, right? But the problem is, people are selfish and want to keep everything for themselves, as if they have legal rights to it or something.
Niek, you've got a pretty low view on bootlegs, because you're used to Queen bootlegs... most of which, on the grand scale of things, are crap. As has already been mentioned, there are so many amazing Zeppelin/Floyd/Who bootlegs out there, and they are completely the work of devoted fans. We have little of that in the Queen community.
I know of so many people who have audience and soundboard recordings of Queen, and for various reasons, they want to keep them to themselves. Here's a list of what I know exists:
London 3-31-74 complete soundboard, clone of master (only complete UK Queen II recording)
Cleveland 1-23-77 soundboard master
Syracuse 2-8-77 audience recording, complete (only complete US ADATR recording)
Atlanta 2-21-77 video
Liverpool 77 complete soundboard (not sure which night)
Los Angeles 12-22-77 audience recording, second generation
Monterrey 10-9-81 video
Puebla 81 video (not sure which night)
Drammen 4-10-82 audience recording
Leiden 9-20-84 soundboard
Auckland 4-13-85 (not sure if it's audience or soundboard)
Leiden 86 soundboard (not sure which night)
These things are all kept under wraps, and many can give us great insight into Queen as a live band. The only recordings of Queen doing White Christmas, Freddie drunk on stage, and concerts in Mexico are all secrets to most of us.
Good topic.
Good question, good thread.
Queen were the first band I started collecting, and video wise I was impressed with what I saw. Mind you, this was several years back and I've changed my mind.
Since I've started collecting Springsteen DVD's, the difference in quality is immense. Within this community are experts; tapers who buy cheap seats to get positions to film. Many of them liase with each other, so their cameras have a clear focus. The mixes are pretty much spot on, and dubbing experts work on remastering audio and synching it all.
Man I wish Queen shows would be available in such a professional way!
Queen were the first band I started collecting, and video wise I was impressed with what I saw. Mind you, this was several years back and I've changed my mind.
Since I've started collecting Springsteen DVD's, the difference in quality is immense. Within this community are experts; tapers who buy cheap seats to get positions to film. Many of them liase with each other, so their cameras have a clear focus. The mixes are pretty much spot on, and dubbing experts work on remastering audio and synching it all.
Man I wish Queen shows would be available in such a professional way!
[QUOTE][QUOTENAME]<font color=black>Dennis Daja<h6>QZs God wrote: [/QUOTENAME]When I still was a little Dennis :-P, I started collecting Queen DVD boots. I didn't know how bootlegs from other artists looked like, so I was pretty satisfied with the stuff I got.
A lot DVD's contained horribly high generation tapes, putted on a disc. People didn't care wether it was in sync, VCD-sourced, Kazaa quality and most of the times without a decent menu.
Ínformation was hard to find, and a good front-cover even harder.
Now I've got into The Who and Pink Floyd boots, and I'm amazed how mutch effort people take to make a nice DVD. Pink Floyd even has "bootleg producers" who collect nice footage, always as low generation as possible. Make proffesional moving menu's ect. I take harvested for example.
The footage might be shot from far and with one camera, they always make it look the best way they can. Most of the times you can choose what kind of audio you want, like 5.1 dolby digital.
There are sites wich contains several covers and technical information about the circulating version.
Another example from The Who (Houston '75). Fans took the effort in collecting 2 audience sources straight from the master, and compile a highly interesting video. It's as enjoyable to watch as a proffesional recording, with Excellent audio. It contains a great menu and they putted on a lot of bonus video's. They always put on bonus video's.
These are just a view examples from artists. Why can't we Queen fans do this? Give the best experience on all of our boots? Why do we keep low generation tapes to ourselves?
[/QUOTE]
Good point. THe Harvested stuff from PF is good stuff. THose guys put in alot of effort into what they do.
I know Kiss fans who collect boots (me included) are generous when it comes to DVD boots. There are alot of audience shows that have 3 or sometimes 4 cam mixes that have been put together. But as always in the trading community there is stuff that remains to be rare trade for a rare trade.
I dont know why people feel the need to hoard bootlegs - especially in the queen world. One way or another, the shits gonna get out - so keeping it for yourself(s) isnt going to do you any good. Just let the people have it. Its no good when only a few people know what a concert sounds/looks like.
A lot DVD's contained horribly high generation tapes, putted on a disc. People didn't care wether it was in sync, VCD-sourced, Kazaa quality and most of the times without a decent menu.
Ínformation was hard to find, and a good front-cover even harder.
Now I've got into The Who and Pink Floyd boots, and I'm amazed how mutch effort people take to make a nice DVD. Pink Floyd even has "bootleg producers" who collect nice footage, always as low generation as possible. Make proffesional moving menu's ect. I take harvested for example.
The footage might be shot from far and with one camera, they always make it look the best way they can. Most of the times you can choose what kind of audio you want, like 5.1 dolby digital.
There are sites wich contains several covers and technical information about the circulating version.
Another example from The Who (Houston '75). Fans took the effort in collecting 2 audience sources straight from the master, and compile a highly interesting video. It's as enjoyable to watch as a proffesional recording, with Excellent audio. It contains a great menu and they putted on a lot of bonus video's. They always put on bonus video's.
These are just a view examples from artists. Why can't we Queen fans do this? Give the best experience on all of our boots? Why do we keep low generation tapes to ourselves?
[/QUOTE]
Good point. THe Harvested stuff from PF is good stuff. THose guys put in alot of effort into what they do.
I know Kiss fans who collect boots (me included) are generous when it comes to DVD boots. There are alot of audience shows that have 3 or sometimes 4 cam mixes that have been put together. But as always in the trading community there is stuff that remains to be rare trade for a rare trade.
I dont know why people feel the need to hoard bootlegs - especially in the queen world. One way or another, the shits gonna get out - so keeping it for yourself(s) isnt going to do you any good. Just let the people have it. Its no good when only a few people know what a concert sounds/looks like.
Now, don't let this become a share or not topic.
The point is that Queen boots are from low gen's and lousy compiled and dressed ect.
And why can't we help eachother out to get nice shows on the market! So you really get an interesting DVD wich you wanna play over and over again.
I also take this Queen+ Paul Rodgers tour as example, there are an AWFUL lot video boots on the market, with a lot of different sources. Why don't we compile those camera shots, and make nice shows with best audio/video?
Even those short shots from like a telephone can have interesting shots in ex. quality.
Perhaps we people could team up and make a Queen+ Paul Rodgers tour DVD collection. With nice menu's, compiled camera shots, nice audio.
But the point is, who can do what? and who is willing to move his/her arse? and who is willing to give his private recording to deliver the best possible experience?
The more angles the interesting!
The point is that Queen boots are from low gen's and lousy compiled and dressed ect.
And why can't we help eachother out to get nice shows on the market! So you really get an interesting DVD wich you wanna play over and over again.
I also take this Queen+ Paul Rodgers tour as example, there are an AWFUL lot video boots on the market, with a lot of different sources. Why don't we compile those camera shots, and make nice shows with best audio/video?
Even those short shots from like a telephone can have interesting shots in ex. quality.
Perhaps we people could team up and make a Queen+ Paul Rodgers tour DVD collection. With nice menu's, compiled camera shots, nice audio.
But the point is, who can do what? and who is willing to move his/her arse? and who is willing to give his private recording to deliver the best possible experience?
The more angles the interesting!
Why bother when there are professionally recorded shows (the stuff which was shown on the screen was also recorded) and in the hands of some collectors ?
Interesting topic...
I'm collecting Nirvana stuff and as the bands you talked about, there is a lot of great stuff and most of the recordings are not mp3-sourced and are the best available because there is a very well structured community. 95 % of the recordings gens are known. Hoarding is not that present in the Nirvana community because the big traders who have the best sources transfer them and put them on the international trading website of Nirvana. This could be the same for Queen on Queenzone but all which is shared here is mostly mp3 and people are happy with it. That's a problem and I don't see any solution. Many of us collectors have a bunch of recordings but some are mp3-sourced or not the best available because there's no people trading or sharing the best sources on the net. The problem also is that sometimes we have some sources which are thought to be the best ones and they are not. And where is the best copy? We don't know.
I can show you some Nirvana websites and I would love the same websites exist for Queen: www.livenirvana.com and www.nirvanaguide.com .
Every single circulating source is described here and there is a hub where only lossless stuff is shared. That's only the way how we can get the best sources.
I'm collecting Nirvana stuff and as the bands you talked about, there is a lot of great stuff and most of the recordings are not mp3-sourced and are the best available because there is a very well structured community. 95 % of the recordings gens are known. Hoarding is not that present in the Nirvana community because the big traders who have the best sources transfer them and put them on the international trading website of Nirvana. This could be the same for Queen on Queenzone but all which is shared here is mostly mp3 and people are happy with it. That's a problem and I don't see any solution. Many of us collectors have a bunch of recordings but some are mp3-sourced or not the best available because there's no people trading or sharing the best sources on the net. The problem also is that sometimes we have some sources which are thought to be the best ones and they are not. And where is the best copy? We don't know.
I can show you some Nirvana websites and I would love the same websites exist for Queen: www.livenirvana.com and www.nirvanaguide.com .
Every single circulating source is described here and there is a hub where only lossless stuff is shared. That's only the way how we can get the best sources.
is it really that hard to spend 10 minutes in Windows Movie Maker messing with the quality untill it looks 20% better?
This topic is an excellent use of the message board and a very worthwhile subject for discussion. Maybe opening a dialogue on the subject will lead to something. Either way, its infinitely more productive than the millionth "was Freddie really gay?" thread. Good show, gents. Given how frequently people on these boards complain about Queen Productions not releasing this and that, its at once inspiring and depressing to realize that we could have been turning out great product on our own but just haven't. Maybe that can change.
maybe a Jazz Collection DVD?
Since there is no real good jazz show. There are certainly alot of clips and things, maybe bonus features being interviews and such?
Since there is no real good jazz show. There are certainly alot of clips and things, maybe bonus features being interviews and such?